HC Deb 11 March 1959 vol 601 cc1286-91

Amendment proposed: In page 13, line 29, at beginning insert: Subject to the provisions of section (Applications for standard grant at instance of tenants (Scotland)) of this Act."—[Mr. T. Fraser.]

Question put, That those words be there inserted:—

The Committee divided: Ayes 200, Noes 236.

Division No. 57.] AYES [4.50 p.m.
Ainsley, J. W. Awbery, S. S. Benson, Sir George
Albu, A. H. Bacon, Miss Alice Beswick, Frank
Allen, Arthur (Bosworth) Balfour, A. Blackburn, F.
Allen, Scholefield (Crewe) Bence, C. R. (Dunbartonshire, E.) Blenkinsop, A.
Blyton, W. R. Hoy, J. H. Price, J. T. (Westhoughton)
Boardman, H. Hughes, Cledwyn (Anglesey) Price, Philips (Gloucestershire, W.)
Bottomley, Rt. Hon. A. G. Hughes, Emrys (S. Ayrshire) Probert, A. R.
Bowden, H. w. (Leicester, S. W.) Hughes, Hector (Aberdeen, N.) Pursey, Cmdr. H.
Bowles, F. G. Hunter, A. E. Randall, H. E.
Boyd, T. C. Hynd, H. (Accrington) Rankin, John
Brockway, A. F. Irvine, A. J. (Edge Hill) Reeves, J.
Broughton, Dr. A. D. D. Irving, Sydney (Dartford) Reid, William
Brown, Rt. Hon. George (Belper) Janner, B. Reynolds, G. W.
Brown, Thomas (Ince) Jeger, George (Goole) Rhodes, H.
Burton, Miss F. E. Jeger, Mrs.Lena(Holbn & St.Pncs.S.) Roberts, Albert (Normanton)
Butler, Herbert (Hackney, C.) Jenkins, Roy (Stechford) Robinson, Kenneth (St. Pancras, N.)
Butler, Mrs. Joyce (Wood Green) Jones, David (The Hartlepools) Ross, William
Castle, Mrs. B. A. Jones, Elwyn (W. Ham, S.) Shinwell, Rt. Hon. E.
Champion, A. J. Jones, Jack (Rotherham) Short, E. W.
Chapman, W. D. Jones, J. Idwal (Wrexham) Silverman, Julius (Aston)
Chetwynd, G. R. Kenyon, C. Simmons, C. J. (Brierley Hill)
Clunie, J. Key, Rt. Hon. C. W. Skeffington, A. M.
Coldrick, W. King, Dr. H. M. Slater, Mrs. H. (Stoke, N.)
Collick, P. H. (Birkenhead) Lee, Frederick (Newton) Slater, J. (Sedgefield)
Corbet, Mrs. Freda Lindgren, G. S. Smith, Ellis (Stoke, S.)
Craddock, George (Bradford, S.) Mabon, Dr. J. Dickson Snow, J. W.
Cronin, J. D. McAlister, Mrs. Mary Sorensen, R. W.
Cullen, Mrs. A. MacColl, J. E. Soskice, Rt. Hon. Sir Frank
Darling, George (Hillsborough) MacDermot, Niall Sparks, J. A.
Davles, Ernest (Enfield, E.) Mclnnes, J. Spriggs, Leslie
Deer, G. McKay, John (Wallsend) Steele, T
de Freitas, Geoffrey McLeavy, Frank Strachey, Rt. Hon. J.
Delargy, H. J. MacPherson, Malcolm (Stirling) Strauss,Rt. Hon. George (Vauxhall)
Diamond, John Mahon, Simon Stress, Dr. Barnett(Stoke-on-Trent, C.)
Dodds, N. N. Mallalieu, E. L. (Brigg) Summerskill, Rt. Hon. E.
Donnelly, D. L. Mallalieu, J. P. W. (Huddersfd, E.) Swingler, S. T.
Ede, Rt. Hon. J. C. Marquand, Rt. Hon. H. A. Sylvester, G. O.
Edelman, M. Mason, Roy Taylor, Bernard (Mansfield)
Edwards, Rt. Hon. John (Brighouse) Mayhew, C. P. Thomson, George (Dundee, E.)
Edwards, Rt. Hon. Ness (Caerphilly) Mellish, R. J. Thornton, E.
Edwards, Robert (Bilston) Messer, Sir F. Timmons, J.
Edwards, W. J. (Stepney) Mikardo, Ian Ungoed-Thomas, Sir Lynn
Evans, Albert (Islington, S.W.) Mitchison, G. R. Viant, S. P.
Fernyhough, E. Monslow, W. Warbey, W. N.
Finch, H. J. (Bedwellty) Moody, A. S. Watkins, T. E.
Fitch, A. E. (Wigan) Morris, Percy (Swansea, w., Weitzman, D.
Fletcher, Eric Morrison, Rt. Hn. Herbert (Lewis'm.S.)
Forman, J. C. Mort, D. L. Wells, Percy (Faversham)
Fraser, Thomas (Hamilton) Moss, R. Wells, William (Walsall, N.)
Gaitskell, Rt. Hon. H. T. N. Moyle, A. Wheeldon, W. E.
Gibson, C. W. Mulley, F. W. White, Mrs. Eirene (E. Flint)
Gordon Walker, Rt. Hon. P. C. Noel-Baker, Francis (Swindon) White, Henry (Derbyshire, N. E.)
Grenfell, Rt. Hon. D. R. Noel-Baker, Rt. Hon. P. (Derby, S.) Wilcock, Group Capt. C. A. B.
Grey, C. F. Oliver, G. H. Wilkins, W. A.
Griffiths. Rt. Hon. James (Llanelly) Oram, A. E. Willey, Frederick
Griffiths, William (Exchange) Owen, W. J. Williams, David (Neath)
Hall, Rt. Hn. Glenvil (Colne Valley) Paget, R. T. Williams, Rt. Hon. T. (Don Valley)
Hamilton, W. w. Palmer, A. M. F. Williams, W. R. (Openshaw)
Hannan, W. Pannell, Charles (Leeds, W.) Williams, W. T. (Barons Court)
Harrison, J. (Nottingham, N.) Pargiter, G. A. Willis, Eustace (Edinburgh, E.)
Hastings, S. Parker, J. Woodburn, Rt. Hon. A.
Hayman, F. H. Parkin, B. T. Woof, R. E.
Healey, Denis Paton, John Yates, V. (Ladywood)
Henderson, Rt. Hn. A. (Rwly Regis) Pearson, A. Younger, Rt. Hon. K,
Herbison, Miss M. Peart, T. F. Zilliacus, K.
Hobson, C. R. (Kelghley) Pentland, N.
Holman, P. Plummer, Sir Leslie TELLERS FOR THE AYES:
Howell, Denis (All Saints) Popplewell, E, Mr. John Taylor and Mr. Rogers.
NOES
Agnew, Sir Peter Bennett, Dr. Reginald Butcher, Sir Herbert
Aitken, W. T. Bevins, J. R. (Toxteth) Campbell, Sir David
Allan, R. A. (Paddington, S.) Biggs-Davison, J. A. Cary, Sir Robert
Alport, C. J. M. Bingham, R. M. Channon, H. P. G.
Amory, Rt. Hn. Heathcoat (Tiverton) Birch, Rt. Hon. Nigel Chichester-Clark, R.
Anstruther-Gray, Major Sir William Bishop, F, P. Clarke, Brig. Terence (Portsmth, W.)
Arbuthnot, John Black, Sir Cyril Cole, Norman
Armstrong, C. W. Body, R. F. Conant, Major Sir Roger
Ashton, H. Bossom, Sir Alfred Cooke, Robert
Baldwin, Sir Archer Bowen, E. R. (Cardigan) Cooper, A. E.
Balniel, Lord Boyd-Carpenter, Rt. Hon. J. A. Cooper-Key, E. M.
Barber, Anthony Braine, B. R. Cordeaux, Lt.-Col. J. K.
Barlow, Sir John Braithwaite, Sir Albert (Harrow, W.) Corfield, F. V.
Barter, John Bromley-Davenport, Lt.-Col. W. H. Craddock, Beresford (Spelthorne)
Batsford, Brian Brooke, Rt. Hon. Henry Crosthwaite-Eyre, Col. O. E.
Beamish, Col. Tufton Brooman-White, R. C. Crowder, Sir John (Finchley)
Bell, Ronald (Bucks, S.) Bryan, P. Crowder, Petre (Ruislip—Northwood)
Bennett, F. M. (Torquay) Bullus, Wing Commander E. E. Currie, G. B. H.
Dance, J. C. G. Iremonger, T. L. Pitt, Miss E. M
do Ferranti, Basil Irvine, Bryant Godman (Rye) Pott, H. P.
Digby, Simon Wingfield Jenkins, Robert (Dulwich) Powell, J. Enoch
Donaldson, Cmdr. C. E. McA. Johnson, Dr. Donald (Carlisle) Price, David (Eastleigh)
Doughty, C. J. A. Johnson, Eric (Blackley) Prior-Palmer, Brig. O. L.
Drayson, G. B. Kimball, M. Profumo, J. D.
du Cann, E, D. L. Kirk, P. M. Ramsden, J. E.
Dugdale, Rt. Hn. Sir T. (Richmond) Lancaster, Col. C. G. Rawlinson, Peter
Duncan, Sir James Langford-Holt, J. A. Redmayne, M.
Eden, J. B. (Bournemouth, West) Leather, E. H. C. Remnant, Hon. P.
Eillott, R. W. (Ne'castle upon Tyne, N.) Leavey, J. A. Ridsdale, J. E.
Emmet, Hon. Mrs. Evelyn Leburn, W. G. Robertson, Sir David
Errington, Sir Eric Legge-Bourke, Maj. E. A. H. Robinson, Sir Roland (Blackpool, S.)
Farey-Jones, F. W. Legh, Hon. Peter (Petersfield) Robson Brown, Sir William
Finlay, Graeme Lindsay, Hon. James (Devon, N.) Rodgers, John (Sevenoaks)
Fisher, Nigel Lindsay, Martin (Solihull) Roper, Sir Harold
Fraser, Hon. Hugh (Stone) Linstead, Sir H. N. Ropner, Col. Sir Leonard
Freeth, Denzil Lloyd, Maj. Sir Guy (Renfrew, E.) Russell, R. S.
Galbraith, Hon. T. G. D. Longden, Gilbert Sandys, Rt. Hon. D.
Gammans, Lady Loveys, Walter H. Scott-Miller, Cmdr. R.
Garner-Evans, E. H. Low, Rt. Hon. Sir Toby Sharples, R. C.
Gibson-Watt, D. Lucas, Sir Jocelyn (Portsmouth, S.) Smithers, Peter (Winchester)
Glover, D. Lucas-Tooth, Sir Hugh Smyth, Brig, Sir John (Norwood)
Glyn, Col. Richard H. Macdonald, Sir Peter Spearman, Sir Alexander
Godber, J. B. Mackeson, Brig. Sir Harry Speir, R. M.
Goodhart, Philip Maclean, Sir Fitzroy (Lancaster) Stanley, Capt, Hon. Richard
Gough, C. F. H. McLean, Neil (Inverness) Stevens, Geoffrey
Cower, H. R. Macmillan, Rt. Hn. Harold (Bromley) Steward, Harold (Stockport, S.)
Grant, Rt. Hon. W. (Woodside) Macmillan, Maurice (Hallfax) Steward, Sir William (Woolwich, W.)
Grant-Ferris, Wg Cdr. R. (Nantwich) Maitland, Cdr.J. F. W.(Horncastle) Stoddart-Scott, Col. Sir Malcolm
Green, A Maitland, Hon. Patrick (Lanark) Stuart, Rt. Hon. James (Moray)
Grimond, J. Manningham-Buller, Rt. Hn. Sir R Summers, Sir Spencer
Grimston, Sir Robert (Westbury) Markham, Major Sir Frank Taylor, William (Bradford, N.)
Grosvenor, Lt.-Col. R. G. Marlowe, A. A. H. Teeling, W.
Garden, Harold Mathew, R. Temple, John M.
Hall, John (Wycombe) Maudling, Rt. Hon. R. Thompson, Kenneth (Walton)
Harris, Frederic (Croydon, N.W.) Mawby, R. L. Thompson, R. (Croydon, S.)
Harris, Reader (Heston) Maydon, Lt.-Comdr. S. L. C. Thornton-Kemsley, Sir Colin
Harvey, Sir Arthur Vere (Macclesf'd) Milligan, Rt. Hon. W. R. Tiley, A. (Bradford, W.)
Hay, John Molson, Rt. Hon. Hugh Tilney, John (Wavertree)
Heald, Rt. Hon. Sir Lionel Moore, Sir Thomas Tweedsmuir, Lady
Heath, Rt. Hon. E. R. G. Mott-Radclyffe, Sir Charles Vane, W. M. F.
Henderson-Stewart, Sir James Nairn, D. L. S. Vaughan-Morgan, J. K.
Hicks-Beach, Maj. W. W. Neave, Alrey Viokers, Miss Joan
Hill, Rt. Hon. Charles (Luton) Nicholls, Harmar Vosper, Rt. Hon. D. F.
Hill, Mrs. E. (Wythenshawe) Nicholson, Sir Godfrey (Farnham) Wade, D. W.
Hill, John (S. Norfolk) Nicolson, N. (B'n'm'th, E. & Chr'ch) Wakefield, Edward (Derbyshire, W.)
Hinchingbrooke, Viscount Noble, Comdr. Rt. Hon. Allan Wakefield, Sir Wavell (St. M'lebone)
Hobson, John(Warwick & Leam'gt'n) Noble, Michael (Argyll) Wall, Patrick
Holland-Martin, C. J, Nugent, G. R. H. Ward, Rt. Hon. G. R. (Worcester)
Holt, A. F. Oakshott, H. D. Ward, Dame Irene (Tynemouth)
Hornby, R. P. O'Neill, Hn. Phelim (Co. Antrim, N.) Watkinson, Rt. Hon. Harold
Horobin, Sir Ian Ormsby-Gore, Rt. Hon. W. D. Webster, David
Horsbrugh, Rt. Hon. Dame Florence Orr, Capt. L. P. S. Wills, Sir Gerald (Bridgwater)
Howard, Gerald (Cambridgeshire) Osborne, C. Wilson, Geoffrey (Truro)
Howard, John (Test) Page, R. G. Wolrige-Gordon, Patrick
Hughes-Young, M. H. C. Panned, N. A. (Kirkdale) Woollam, John Victor
Hurd, Sir Anthony Partridge, E. Yates, William (The Wrekin)
Hutchison, Michael Clark(E'b'gh, S.) Peel, W. J.
Hutchison, Sir Ian Clark(E'b'gh, W.) Peyton, J. W. W. TELLERS FOR THE NOES:
Hutchison, Sir James (Scotstoun) Pilkington, Capt. R. A. Colonel J. H. Harrison and
Hylton-Foster, Rt. Hon. Sir Harry Pitman, I. J. Mr. Whitelaw.

Clause 20 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Bill reported, with Amendments; as amended (in Committee and on recommittal), considered.

5.0 p.m.

Mr. Deputy-Speaker (Sir Gordon Touche)

The first new Clause selected is that in the name of the hon. and learned Member for Kettering (Mr. Mitchison) and his hon. Friends. I think it would be convenient also to discuss the new Clause standing in the name of the hon. Lady the Member for Lanarkshire, North (Miss Herbison) and certain of her hon. Friends.

Mr. Thomas Fraser (Hamilton)

On a point of order. The first new Clause standing in the name of my two hon. Friends and myself was put down during the Committee stage but was not then selected. You have just ruled, Sir Gordon, that you are selecting the second new Clause on this page. The first new Clause merely seeks to repeat in Scotland a protection which is given to tenants of improved houses by Clause 12 as it applies to England.

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

The new Clauses have been selected by Mr. Speaker and I cannot alter that decision. The first new Clause has not been selected.

Mr. Fraser

I should like your guidance, Sir Gordon. People in Scotland will be put in a very awkward position. By Mr. Speaker's failure to select the Clause and the failure of the Chairman of Ways and Means when the Bill was before the Committee, Scottish Members on both sides of the House are denied the opportunity of claiming the protection for tenants in Scotland which the Bill affords to tenants in England. Is there nothing that we can do about it?

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

We cannot discuss the merits of the matter. The first new Clause has not been selected.

Mr. Fraser

Is there no way by which Members of Parliament can claim the right to speak up for Scottish tenants?

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

The hon. Gentleman could have made representations to Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Fraser

I understand that very strong representations were made to Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

I understand that Mr. Speaker has come to a decision on the matter. I have no power to alter that decision.

Mr. William Ross (Kilmarnock)

Scottish hon. Members are placed in an invidious position. What can we do to have the matter rectified?

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

If the hon. Member for Kilmarnock (Mr. Ross) is dissatisfied he can put down a Motion, but he cannot debate the matter now.

Mr. E. G. Willis (Edinburgh, East)

In view of the fact that no Scottish Minister is present to take note of the complaint so that it might be remedied—

Mr. Deputy-Speaker

That is not a point of order.