HC Deb 16 December 1959 vol 615 cc1443-6
47. Mr. Emrys Hughes

asked the Prime Minister to what extent the statement of the Secretary of State for the Home Department in Northern Ireland about the possibility of a policy of sanctions against the Irish Republic represent the policy of Her Majesty's Government.

Mr. R. A. Butler

I have been asked to reply.

I was answering hypothetical questions and made no statement of policy.

Mr. Hughes

Does not the right hon. Gentleman realise the very grave situation which arises when he raises hypothetical questions in places like Ireland? Is he aware that this remark will weaken the hands of those who are opposed to violence in Southern Ireland? Is he also aware that economic sanctions may add to the difficulties of dealing with unemployment in Northern Ireland and also make difficulties regarding unemployment on the West Coast of Scotland from which exports go to Ireland?

Mr. Butler

No, Sir. I do not accept that. It was not I who put the hypothetical questions. It was the members of the Press who put certain hypothetical questions to me. I made no statement of policy. I said that if there were ever to be sanctions they would have to be effective, but I did not give any indication of policy whatsoever. In conclusion, should like to say that I do not accept that the results will be as indicated by the hon. Member.

Lieut.-Colonel Grosvenor

Does my right hon. Friend realise that, in the last three years, 4 British policemen have been killed and 24 British policemen wounded and nearly £¾ million worth of damage done, all of which is chargeable to the British taxpayer, added to which there have been 318 incidents, which is an average of nearly three a week?

Mr. Butler

I am obliged to my hon. and gallant Friend for bringing to the notice of the House the gravity of the situation as it is seen in Northern Ireland. I think it is most important that the Government and the people of Northern Ireland should feel that behind them they have Her Majesty's Government and the people of this country.

Mr. Gordon Walker

Does not the right hon. Gentleman feel that, however grave the situation and the feeling in Northern Ireland, his remarks on this occasion were extremely maladroit and have caused a great deal of trouble? Does he not frankly wish that he had not given that answer?

Mr. Butler

No, Sir. I stand absolutely by what I said. I was accompanied at the Press conference by the Prime Minister of Northern Ireland who saw nothing objectionable or difficult in anything that I said. The matter was perfectly correctly reported by the Belfast Telegraph and other newspapers, and it has been perfectly correctly reported also by The Times on Tuesday, 15th December. I see nothing wrong in what I said. I only hope that it will have done good in the situation.

Mr. McMaster

Is my right hon. Friend aware of the concern which is felt in Northern Ireland over the persistence of these raids at midnight across the Ulster border from the Republic of Ireland? Is my right hon. Friend aware of the need to do everything possible to stop these murderous attacks, often on individual local policemen going their lawful rounds, by young armed hooligans who lie in ambusn in ditches at the side of lonely country roads at night?

Mr. Butler

I am aware of the situation and I have been twice to see it for myself. I also said, in the course of answering questions put by the Press, that I was aware that the head of the Government in Eire, that is, Southern Ireland, was aware of the position and I think regrets it. I think the most and the best we can hope for is that the Government of Eire will exercise the utmost restraint and control of this situation in the light of what they believe.

Mr. Gaitskell

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that all of us deplore these outbreaks of violence on the border? The question, however, is whether the imposition of economic sanctions against Ireland is the right way of dealing with them. Would it not have been better if the answer which the right hon. Gentleman has just given had been given at the Press conference?

Mr. Butler

The strange part is that the answer I have just given is one of the answers I did give at the Press conference. It did not receive the same publicity as the rest. I personally feel that the Press have a difficult task and we should always support what they do. I did myself answer in that sense.

Mr. Gaitskell

In order to assist the Press in their difficult task, would it not be a good idea if the right hon. Gentleman would now quite formally disavow the idea of sanctions against Ireland?

Mr. Butler

I have nothing to add to or substract from what I said.