HC Deb 14 April 1959 vol 603 cc943-4
Mr Macleod

I beg to move, in page 8, line 32, to leave out certain ".

Mr Speaker

I suggest that this and the next two Amendments to lines 34 and 35 can be taken together.

Mr Iain Macleod

I am now coming back into the firing line, Sir. I thought I had arranged an exact division with my hon. Friend the Parliamentary Secretary, but now I think I have had the better of the bargain because we spent so much time on Clause 6.

In Committee, we had more than one excellent debate on this important Clause, which deals with first-aid. The main point put to me then was on the question of the number 50, which is laid down in Section 45 of the 1937 Act as the number which requires that a responsible person in charge of the first-aid box shall be trained in first-aid treatment. A number of hon. Members opposite urged that smaller factories ought to have a person trained in first-aid, and I undertook that by Report stage I would see whether 50 was or was not the right minimum.

Frankly, I am not yet ready to say whether 50 is or is not the right number, but these Amendments give me the power, which, I think, meets entirely what was urged in Committee, to alter this number. Section 45 of the 1937 Act would not allow me to vary the minimum number. These three Amendments are necessary to enable me to fulfill my undertaking and to enable me or any other Minister of Labour, if he so desires, to reduce the figure from 50.

Mr. Lee

We are grateful to the Minister for putting down these Amendments. He has reminded us of the very important discussion which we had in Committee about the whole question of the boxes and how we should treat them. For my part, I am confirmed in my opinion that the sooner we get rid of such things the better, no matter what size the factory, but I recognise at once that that is not a practical proposition and that we shall probably have to compromise for a considerable time.

By these Amendments the Minister is probably taking the right approach in all the circumstances. We are grateful to him for what he has done. We do not feel by any means that it is the end of the story in this phase of factory legislation, but it is probably the best attempt which can be made. We are grateful to him for making it and we join with him in commending the Amendments to the House.

Amendment agreed to.

Further Amendments made: In page 8, line 34, after " treatment ", insert: if more than fifty persons are employed in the factory ".

In page 8, line 35, at end insert: and the Minister may by regulations extend that requirement to cases where the persons employed exceed such lower number as may be specified in the regulations ".— [Mr. Iain Macleod.]