HC Deb 28 April 1958 vol 587 cc9-11
18. Dr. D. Johnson

asked the Minister of Health, as representing the Lord President of the Council, whether he will consult the Medical Research Council with a view to obtaining a supply of the Russian vaccine for multiple sclerosis for the purpose of conducting, in this country, suitable tests of the efficacy of this vaccine.

The Minister of Health (Mr. Derek Walker-Smith)

No final decision can be taken about the use of this vaccine until information about it is received from the Soviet Union. In the meantime, in view of the evidence available from laboratory investigations carried out in the United Kingdom and in America which throw doubt upon both its safety and effectiveness, the Medical Research Council does not propose to undertake clinical trials of its possible value in the treatment of multiple sclerosis.

Dr. Johnson

I thank my right hon. and learned Friend for his reply. May I ask whether he recalls, despite the statement he has made, that he also said that he will allow imports of this vaccine through private sources, and that people who are extremely anxious to effect such imports—if the vaccine is any good—are desperately in need of further guidance on the subject? Can the Medical Research Council give such guidance so that when constituents write to hon. Members about this vaccine we have some authoritative opinion to quote?

Mr. Walker-Smith

The imports are on the individual guidance and responsibility of a practitioner recommending it. In the general sense, with his knowledge of these matters, my hon. Friend will realise that the tests on this subject will take a long time to carry out. Meanwhile, pending information from the Soviet Union, my hon. Friend may be interested, for example, to look at the conclusions of Professor Dick, published in the British Medical Journal earlier this year and he will also be able, I hope, to study the conclusions of Dr. Sabin of Cincinatti when they are published.

Dr. Summerskill

In view of the fact that we have little information about the etiology or the treatment of this very serious and tragic disease, can the Minister tell the House why, because there has been little success on the part of those concerned with the two inquiries, the Medical Research Council—the most authoritative research body in this country—should not examine this vaccine, even though it does take a long time?

Mr. Walker-Smith

There is no evidence that any adequately controlled clinical trial of the effectiveness of this vaccine has ever been undertaken anywhere. As the right hon. Lady, with her professional qualifications, will realise, in a disease of such protracted course over many years in which all patients show periods of remission which may be complete for several years, the design and execution of a therapeutic trial is exceedingly difficult. However carefully planned any such trial may be, I am advised that it cannot be expected to provide reliable results in less than five years, and perhaps we had better await the Soviet answer.

Dr. Summerskill

I apologise for pressing this point, but the Minister has not given a satisfactory answer. This is a disease from which patients have suffered for many years and the Minister says that, as it might take five years for the inquiry, we should sit back and wait for the Soviet Union to execute its own inquiry and report to the world. This is a most unsatisfactory answer.

Mr. Walker-Smith

I did not suggest that we should wait for the Soviet Union necessarily to institute its own clinical trial. I suggested that we should await information to show what claims it made for this officially and what is the basis thereof. Meanwhile, if the right hon. Lady will consider the published works to which I referred—I do not know whether she has yet considered them——

Dr. Summerskill

I have.

Mr. Walker-Smith

I beg the right hon. Lady's pardon. From her supplementary question I apprehended that she had not studied the works I have in mind.

Mrs. Braddock

In view of the fact that the Minister is prepared to allow the import of this vaccine privately, does he not think it would be very advisable for some investigation to take place? If perchance through a private experiment a sufferer got great relief, it might cause a difficult situation if this vaccine could be obtained only through private sources?

Mr. Walker-Smith

The position is that I would not stop the import of this vaccine if it were undertaken on the individual responsibility of a general practitioner who took responsibility for his own judgment. But in the generality, from what I know and have so far been able to ascertain about it, I could not recommend it, pending further investigation, particularly in view of the conclusions, not only of Professor Dick or Dr. Sabin to whom I have referred, but also of Dr. Broman of Gotenburg.