HC Deb 14 May 1957 vol 570 cc187-9
2. Mr. Lee

asked the Minister of Labour what information he has as to the incidence of night working amongst engineering apprentices, and the effects of this upon their technical training.

The Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Labour and National Service (Mr. Robert Carr)

I am afraid I have no information of this kind. The only information I could obtain relevant to this matter would be the numbers of boys between the ages of 16 and 18 years in the engineering industry who do some night work. I know that the numbers are extremely small, and I doubt whether the exact information would be sufficiently useful to justify a special inquiry.

Mr. Lee

Is the Parliamentary Secretary aware that at recent national conferences of the A.E.U. apprentices concerned have informed us that some of their colleagues are losing their chance of taking technical education because they are up all night at work and then, during the day, naturally, they cannot get to the technical courses which are very important for them at that stage? Would the hon. Gentleman, perhaps, consider what can be done to influence employers not to put apprentices in need of technical training on to night work at that period of their careers?

Mr. Carr

If what the hon. Gentleman refers to is happening, I certainly agree that it is undesirable, and I should like to look at any information that he has. There is, of course, as he will appreciate, machinery within the industry which should look after this, and I think that that is really the proper safeguarding machinery in this sort of matter.

4. Mr. Lee

asked the Minister of Labour what improvements have been granted by employers during the past few years in the facilities for technical training of apprentices in the engineering industry.

Mr. Carr

I assume that the hon. Member refers to facilities for technical training provided as part of further education. The available statistics about day release do not distinguish between apprentices and other young people. In the industry group comprising engineering, ship-building and the manufacture of electric goods, the number of students released by employers for part-time education in technical colleges rose from 122,000 to 150,000 in the past four years. I understand also that while precise figures are not available, steadily increasing numbers of young people are being sent by their employers on "sandwich" courses in engineering subjects in technical colleges.

Mr. Lee

I am grateful to the Minister for those very encouraging figures. Would he agree that the general pattern is not satisfactory; that some employers are very good indeed in helping in every way to provide these facilities for their apprentices, and indeed in doing as much as they can inside the works to help in this way, but that some other employers are not so good? Does not that penalise the good employer? Would he publicise:he fact that the Minister would welcome more assistance from that less helpful type of employer in this matter?

Mr. Carr

I will certainly do everything I can to encourage employers to give proper facilities. Here again, I hope that the Report of the Committee on Training Facilities may be some help in that direction.

Mr. W. R. Williams

Will the hon. Gentleman ask his right hon. Friend the Minister of Labour very carefully to study some of the new schemes which are being adopted by German firms in connection with facilities granted to train and educate apprentices in technical and other matters, because in my opinion these are very well worth studying and possibly adopting in British industry?

Mr. Carr

I am sure that my right hon. Friend will do that. As a matter of fact, he is paying a visit to Germany in two days' time. I also hope to lead a deputation from my Committee on the training of younger workers to Germany later in the summer.

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