War Disabled Pensioners (Hansard, 18 February 1957)

§ 41. Mr. H. Hynd
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if he is aware that the recent award of special 23 age allowance to war pensioners is being deducted from their National Assistance payments; and whether this is done by his authority.

§ 54. Mr. Simmons
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if he is aware that war disabled pensioners who are now eligible for the age allowance but are in receipt of National Assistance are having their National Assistance grants reduced by the amount of their age allowance; and if he will take the necessary steps to ensure that these 1914–18 war disabled veterans receive in full the benefits he intended them to receive.

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
In the case of war disability pensioners receiving National Assistance who qualify for the special age allowance, 20s. of the pension will already be disregarded in the assessment of their resources for National Assistance purposes. The amount by which a pension exceeds 20s. is taken into account by the National Assistance Board in accordance with the National Assistance Act.

§ Mr. Hynd
Is this not about the meanest thing yet that this Government has done? Is the right hon. Gentleman not aware that a lot of my constituents have got a special allowance of 5s. and that this amount is immediately knocked off their National Assistance payments? Is that not a mean thing to do?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
I can to a certain extent understand the hon. Gentleman's feelings, but he should not try to make a political point out of this. The provision is exactly the same as that when other social benefits have been improved by various Governments. Under the original Act, the Act of 1948, the Assistance Board has been statutorily bound to take this into account in assessing the applicants' needs.

§ Mr. Marquand
While that is true, does the Minister not think that many of these disregards are now stated in terms of money in 1948, and would it not be a good thing to review them and increase them?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
I am always willing to consider any suggestion from the right hon. Gentleman, but he will himself appreciate that any widespread change in the system of disregards has 24 the disadvantage of giving the extra relief in the very direction in which, in the nature of things, it is less needed than others.

§ Mr. J. Griffiths
Since Parliament in 1946 and 1948 agreed that there should be payments of a certain amount in various categories, is there not now a very strong case for reviewing these amounts in order to make their real value in 1957 equal to the increase in the cost of living?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
I would not decline to look at any suggestions the right hon. Gentleman makes on this very difficult subject, but I would not necessarily agree with him that disregards should be treated in the same way as benefits from the point of view of the effect on them of changes in prices.

§ Mr. Simmons
Was not this in fact a special concession made as a result of the campaign by B.L.E.S.M.A. to give additional benefits to ageing war veterans of the First World War? Was this not a question of disallowance on the first 20s. of pension, but a supplementary—not a pension? Is not this practice defeating the object which B.L.E.S.M.A. had in mind and to which the Minister acceded quite recently? Surely the right hon. Gentleman is clever enough not to be double-crossed by the Treasury on this matter?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
This is a treatment of a supplementary allowance in exactly the same way as all the other supplementary allowances under The war pensions scheme have been treated. As the hon. Member for Brierley Hill (Mr. Simmons) with his experience of war pensions administration will know, in the case of many seriously war disabled the pension takes them out of the scope of National Assistance.

§ Dame Irene Ward
Will my right hon. Friend reconsider this question, having regard to the fact that this was a concession won after many years of fighting? Could not my right hon. Friend put to the Chairman of the National Assistance Board that it would be the wish of everyone that there should be some particular arrangement about this special new concession? Would it be within the power of the Chairman of the National Assistance Board to direct that it should be treated in a special fashion? If so, will 25 my right hon. Friend make representations to that effect and to have that done? That is what we want to know.

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
I will try to answer some of the supplementary questions put to me by my hon. Friend. In reply to the penultimate question, the Assistance Board is bound by statute in this matter. In reply to the first part of my hon. Friend's supplementary question, I would refer her to what I said to hon. Members opposite about the more serious cases. I am sure my hon. Friend knows more than anyone else that most concessions are won after very vigorous fighting.

§ Mr. Hynd
I beg to give notice that, in view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply, I shall seek to raise the matter again on the Adjournment.

§ 51. Mr. Swingler
asked the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance if he has yet considered the resolution passed on 27th January by the Staffordshire County Conference of the British Legion concerning the special allowance for disabled pensioners, a copy of which has been sent to him; and if he will give sympathetic consideration to remedying this grievance.

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
Yes, Sir. I have seen this resolution and the hon. Member will by now have received my hon. Friend the Joint Parliamentary Secretary's letter in reply to the one with which the hon. Member was good enough to forward it. I have nothing to add to this except to say that I do not think that the word "grievance" is properly applied to the necessary limitations on an improvement which, as my hon. Friend explained, is designed to concentrate the resources available where they are most needed.

§ Mr. Swingler
While thanking the Joint Parliamentary Secretary for his very full reply, may I ask whether the Minister is not aware that there is very strong feeling that this allowance should be only an interim measure and that it should be extended to all pensioners? Is he aware that there are many war pensioners who are not so severely disabled and not so old as to benefit from this allowance but who are, nevertheless, very hard hit by the spiral of rising prices and are having a difficult time? Will the Minister there- 26 fore keep this matter before him all the while?

§ Mr. Boyd-Carpenter
Of course, it is always possible to argue that the line of demarcation in any improvement should be further out, but if one allowed oneself to be deterred by that it simply would not be possible to make improvements of this kind to deal with the hardest cases.