HC Deb 18 July 1956 vol 556 cc1190-1
24. Mr. G. R. Strauss

asked the Minister of Transport and Civil Aviation what are the particular principles of private enterprise not now in force which it is proposed to apply to the railways.

Mr. Watkinson

The most important principles of enlightened private enterprise are to give as good or better service than one's competitors; to provide such a service under fair and reasonable conditions at a fair and reasonable price. The purpose of the 1953 Act was to give the Commission freedom to develop these principles.

Mr. Strauss

Is not it really ridiculous to suggest that there are any principles of efficiency which apply particularly to private enterprise or to public enterprise? In view of the enormous strides made by the British Transport Commission in the greater efficiency of its railways, which have been revealed every year in its Annual Report, is not it slighting to the Commission and its staff to suggest that there are ideals or proposals which are peculiar to private enterprise which they have not thought of?

Mr. Watkinson

I do not agree with that, but I think that it is a perfectly fair point. There is a fundamental difference between the right hon. Gentleman and his colleagues and the Government. The difference is that they quite sincerely believe—and I do not question it for a moment—that the right way to run a nationalised industry is to run it on strictly nationalised principles which, the whole country accepts, have, on the whole, failed. [HON. MEMBERS: "No."] The Government's view is that the right way to run these nationally-owned industries is on the principles of enlightened private enterprise, with competition and the use of most up-to-date business methods. That is the clear difference between the two sides of the House.

Mr. Gresham Cooke

Has not British industry in the last hundred years built up a good code of managerial efficiency on which the nationalised industries might draw?

Mr. Strauss

Is not the Minister making a great mistake in trying to bring these political arguments into a technical problem of efficiency? Is not it a fact that the principle on which the nationalised industries—this and the others—run is the principle of giving the best possible service to the nation and to the people? In view of the extraordinary progress, the reduction of costs all round, and the extraordinarily cheap services for freight and passengers on the railways which the Commission gives, compared with the prices asked in almost every other industry, is not it ridiculous to suggest that we should introduce principles from some other system, from private enterprise, in order to teach this great national service what it ought to do?

Mr. Watkinson

I do not think that this is a matter that we can properly debate at Question Time. I would only answer by saying that if the right hon. Gentleman will study the 1953 Act, the statements made by the Government on the modernisation plan, and the 1956 Act—and he knows what they contain—he will see that they have radically changed the organisation of the Commission to its advantage—[HON. MEMBERS: "No."]—by making it into a more flexible and commercial undertaking.