§ Mr. SpeakerYesterday, the hon. Member for Dudley (Mr. Wigg) raised a point of Privilege, which I have had an opportunity of considering. As the House knows, my duty on these occasions is not to say whether there has or has not been a breach of Privilege, but merely to say whether the hon. Member who raises the matter has made out a prima facie case such as would enable me to give it priority over the Orders of the Day.
I understand that the hon. Member for Lanark (Mr. Patrick Maitland) does not complain about the newspaper in any way. Therefore, it seems to me that there is no complaint about the newspaper—indeed, the hon. Member for Dudley said so yesterday. Nor, in what has been said, do I see any prima facie case of any breach of Privilege by the hon. Member for Lanark.
I would remark that animadversions against the conduct of Whips are common on both sides of the House. These have never hitherto been treated as breaches of the Privilege of the whole House. As for any question of breach of Privilege by the usual channels, if that be the proper term, the only hon. Member who could complain about it with real knowledge is the hon. Member for Lanark himself.
As the hon. Member for Lanark made the speech on Friday, if he wanted to complain about the subject on Friday that would have been his earliest opportunity of doing so. Therefore, I cannot see that there is a prima facie case of breach of Privilege against anyone such as would enable me to give the matter precedence over the Orders of the Day.
§ Mr. WiggThank you for your consideration of this matter, Mr. Speaker. May I point that there is one small slip which you have made—[HON. MEMBERS: "Oh."]—one slight error of fact, which I would point out with respect. The hon. Member for Lanark (Mr. Patrick Maitland) did not make a speech. What he did was to give a prepared statement to the Press. Since that time, I have seen a copy of it—
§ Mr. SpeakerI do not think we want to hear it. If it was not a speech, it does not matter. If the hon. Member for Lanark was suffering from any sense that a breach of Privilege had occurred against the House, he had an opportunity of raising it on Friday but did not do so. What he said to the Press is, I think, irrelevant in the matter.
§ Mr. WiggI have not the slightest intention of reading the statement, Sir. I want to point out, however, that the hon. Member for Lanark did make a statement to the Press. It is quite clear that as the hon. Member does not now wish to make a statement, having fortified himself by the knowledge that he had dared to show himself in the House, the charge of a breach of Privilege lies against the Patronage Secretary. It is perfectly clear that the hon. Member for Lanark is asserting that he and 14 of his colleagues were under such pressure that they had to dare to come to the House. Therefore—
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. I have already taken that into account and ruled that it does not, to my mind, constitute a breach of Privilege by anyone. Therefore, the hon. Member for Dudley (Mr. Wigg) should accept the Ruling.
§ Mr. WiggWith respect, Mr. Speaker —[HON. MEMBERS: "Sit down".]—may I be allowed to conclude my submission? The hon. Member for Lanark admits the accuracy of the statement which appeared in the Press and he asserts that it was necessary for him and 14 of his colleagues to dare to show themselves in this place. The daring may be one of two kinds; it may be physical daring or moral daring, or, of course, it may be neither. The hon. Member asserted that it was necessary to show daring in order to show himself at this House. The House cannot possibly function if it is necessary to dare against the Patronage Secretary.
Therefore—[HON. MEMBERS: "Sitdown."]—it is my submission that there is a prima facie case, although I admit, Mr. Speaker, that you are in great difficulty, because the only person who can give evidence on the point is the hon. Member for Lanark, and he has not got the guts to repeat in the House what he said in Glasgow.
§ Mr. SpeakerThe hon. Member for Dudley should not make charges of that kind against the hon. Member for Lanark. That is not the way to deal with it.
§ Mr. SpeakerOrder. I am quite prepared to participate in a little harmless amusement occasionally if that be the intention of hon. Members. I would point out, however, that Privilege is a very serious thing and that, personally, I cannot find myself in the position of treating it lightly.
I have given my Ruling on this matter and I must remind the hon. Member for Dudley that if he disagrees with what I have said, he is at liberty to put dawn a Motion either saying that it is a breach of Privilege and asking for the decision of the House in the matter, or, if he thinks I am wrong in my Ruling on the matter, saying that I am wrong in not giving it priority. He can put down a Motion against my decision, but that is all he can do.
§ Mr. SpeakerI have already ruled on it. Does the hon. and learned Member have a substantial point?
§ Mr. PagetFurther to that point of Privilege, Sir. I understood yesterday that in reply to the hon. Member for 228 Berwick and East Lothian (Sir W. Anstruther-Gray) you said that the hon. Member for Lanark (Mr. Patrick Maitland) should be given an opportunity to make a statement. Speaking for those of us here, may I say that we are very disappointed? It sounded as though it would be a most fascinating experience.
§ Mr. SpeakerI think the hon. and learned Member would agree that I was right in not coming to a decision without giving the hon. Member for Lanark an opportunity to make a statement if he so wished. I have, however, asked him and he has told me that has no complaint about the newspaper. That is the ground of the first part of my decision. If the hon. Member for Lanark does not wish to make a statement, I do not see why I or anybody else should press him to do so.
§ Mr. Patrick MaitlandIn reply to the things that have been said, Mr. Speaker, I should like to say that I did not invite the protection of the hon. Member for Dudley (Mi. Wigg). He did not give me advance warning that he was raising this matter and I have nothing further to say.