HC Deb 22 October 1953 vol 518 cc2153-6
The Prime Minister

With your permission, Mr. Speaker, I wish to inform the House that Her Majesty's Government have had under consideration for some time the operation of the law relating to the certification and detention of persons suffering from mental illness and mental defect and realise that legislation is desirable to bring that law into line with modern thought and development. They consider, however, that there should first be a comprehensive review of the subject by an independent body, and for this purpose the Queen has been pleased to signify her intention of setting up a Royal Commission To inquire, as regards England and Wales, into the existing law and administrative machinery governing the certification, detention, care (other than hospital care or treatment under the National Health Service Acts, 1946–52), absence on trial or licence, discharge and supervision of persons who are or are alleged to be suffering from mental illness or mental defect, other than Broadmoor patients; to consider, as regards England and Wales, the extent to which it is now, or should be made, statutorily possible for such persons to be treated, as voluntary patients, without certification; and to make recommendations. The names of the Chairman and other members will be announced later.

Mr. Bevan

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that on this side of the House we welcome the announcement he has now made? I wish to ask only two questions: why is Scotland excluded? We understand that the law of Scotland is different from that of England in this matter, but is the right hon. Gentleman satisfied that the Scottish law does not require to be brought more up-to-date? Is he also aware that the language used in the last part of his announcement might give the impression that there are no voluntary patients whereas, as he knows, a very large proportion of patients treated in our mental institutions are voluntary? It is because the treatment is so satisfactory that we desire to have the principle extended. Therefore, I hope that when the announcement is made figures will be given to show the extent of this in our mental institutions in order that other countries may learn what a high proportion of voluntary patients we have in our mental institutions.

The Prime Minister

The law of Scotland is different and has already been the subject of careful thought and attention. Naturally, we are fully alive to the question of Scotland and it will be in a foremost position, although this particular inquiry is limited to England and Wales. What was the other question?

Mr. Bevan

The question of voluntary patients.

The Prime Minister

We well know that that is the case and great advantage has been achieved thereby. It is intended to extend that as far as possible, subject, of course, always to making quite sure that people are properly protected by certification in cases where treatment involves a considerable measure of restraint.

Lieut.-Colonel Elliot

Is my right hon. Friend aware of any suggestion that the inquiry should be in any way extended to cover the law of Scotland—which is quite different and has been working on quite a different system—and that nothing but harm could come from a general inquiry which tried to cover two very different systems in the one inquiry?

Mr. Woodburn

Would the terms of the Commission include the very difficult problem of old people who have been certified in order to give them house room in mental institutions where they are suffering, perhaps, from decay of their mental faculties without necessarily being insane? It is a very serious problem, one of care and maintenance of the old rather than of insanity. Would that part of the remit be given to the Commission? It applies in both countries.

The Prime Minister

I certainly think that that is a matter which will come under the consideration of the Commission.

Mr. Bevan

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that no suggestion is being made that this Royal Commission should consider the Scottish law as well as the law in England and Wales? What I asked was whether the Government are satisfied that the Scottish law does not require also to be brought into line with modern thought and practice? That is what I should like to know, whether there is to be a separate Commission of inquiry for Scotland?

The Prime Minister

I was not ruling out a Scottish inquiry; I think it would be a pity to mix them together. I am advised that that is so, but it seems to me fairly certain that the one would lead to the other. At any rate, we will take no decision to the contrary.

Dr. Bennett

Can my right hon. Friend say whether the intention is that this Commission shall go into, consider, and possibly revise the definitions of mental defects in the course of its inquiries?

The Prime Minister

I should have thought that that was really what it was about.

Mr. Woodburn

Further to the point about Scotland, may I ask if, in due course, the Prime Minister proposes to set up a Commission for Scotland he will see that an announcement is made to the House—not just made in the Press—so that the House may be aware of what is happening?

The Prime Minister

Yes, Sir, I should certainly like to convey that important announcement to Scotland as soon as I am in a position to do so.

Mrs. Braddock

In view of the fact that there are many new methods of dealing both with mental illness and mental deficiency, when considering the type of person to serve on this Commission, will the right hon. Gentleman see that he includes some of the younger school of medical practitioners, who are fully qualified in psychiatry?

The Prime Minister

I will certainly bear that in mind.

Mr. Hector Hughes

Are not the reasons given by the Prime Minister quite insufficient to justify him leaving Scottish needs out of consideration, having regard to the fact that Scottish experts could be appointed to sit on the Commission and Scottish witnesses could be called before it? Although the law in Scotland is different from that of England, it is no less in need of being brought up-to-date.

The Prime Minister

It is not a question of leaving Scotland out, but of treating it separately.