HC Deb 08 July 1953 vol 517 cc1240-2
45. Mr. Wyatt

asked the Prime Minister whether he will invite the Prime Ministers of France, Italy, Holland and Belgium and the Chancellor of the Federal German Republic, to a conference to consider the means by which Britain can take part in a European army which does not contain those features of the European Defence Community which have made Her Majesty's Government unable to join that community.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr. R. A. Butler)

No, Sir. The European Defence Community Treaty was signed by the governments of the countries mentioned by the hon. Member, and by Luxembourg. The policy of Her Majesty's Government is to do their utmost to bring about the creation of the European Defence Community at the earliest possible date and to do all they can to support it and associate themselves with it.

Mr. Wyatt

Yes, but has not the Chancellor of the Exchequer noticed that the European Defence Community is about to collapse, and will not now be ratified, and are we now to take it that under the present regime no decisions on these important issues will be taken for an indefinite period?

Mr. Butler

No, Sir. As is not infrequently the case, the hon. Gentleman is totally wrong. One of the main reasons for the projected talks in Washington is to undertake discussions on this particular subject among others. The hon. Gentleman may feel assured that this matter will be discussed with the United States and French Governments and that there could be no better venue for such a discussion.

Mr. Noel-Baker

Since the proposals made by Her Majesty's Government and British co-operation in this scheme may well be decisive with the six European Parliaments concerned, and since they are also of great importance to this country, is it not about time that the Government told us what it is that they have proposed?

Mr. Butler

I think the views of the Government on this matter have frequently been expressed and, as the right hon. Gentleman knows, the E.D.C. has the full support of Her Majesty's Government, the United States Government and the other N.A.T.O. Governments, and the next step is to ratify and not to revise it.

Mr. Wyatt

But is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that we have never yet been told what proposals we have made, or what proposals have been made to us by the Governments of France and the other Governments concerned? Is it not a fact that in the present state of affairs in Her Majesty's Government it is quite impossible for them to take the initiative on anything?

Mr. Butler

The hon. Gentleman should think again before he makes such a remark. The acting Foreign Secretary is proceeding tonight to Washington to negotiate on these and other matters. I think it would be much better if this House were to wish him well in his mission rather than to make remarks such as the hon. Gentleman has made.

Mr. Noel-Baker

Of course everybody in the House will wish the acting Foreign Secretary well in his mission, but the Chancellor seems not to be aware that we have never been told what we proposed to the French and what the French answered. What we want to know is what has passed.

Mr. Butler

The best answer to that is that the House will obviously have to be informed of the results of the conversations in Washington, and as those will be the most recent conversations on this subject, it would be wise for the House to await the outcome of those conversations.

Mr. Shinwell

But is the right hon. Gentleman aware that negotiations about the European Defence Community have been going on for upwards of two years, and that the present Government have been participating in the discussions? Why is he so snooty when questions are asked?

Mr. Butler

I am not nearly so snooty as the right hon. Gentleman usually is. The attitude of Her Majesty's Government has been consecutive in this matter. It would be a great mistake to lay all the difficulties and delays in ratifying E.D.C. at the door of Her Majesty's Government.

Mr. Wyatt

Can we have any assurance that we shall ever be told what is discussed about this matter at the Washington conference, because we have never yet been told what has been discussed between ourselves and the E.D.C. countries over the last six months, although I have asked repeated questions and have been told every time to wait and see?

Mr. Butler

I have already said, and I will repeat, that it will be the intention of the Government to inform the House of the outcome of the conversations in Washington, and I hope the hon. Gentleman and other hon. and right hon. Gentlemen will remain content with that.

Mr. H. Morrison

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman whether it is the case that he feels in a great difficulty about answering questions on this matter, and also whether, in those circumstances, it is any improvement of the situation for him to get rather cross and bad-tempered about it?

Mr. Butler

The right hon. Gentleman will get no rise out of me. I was simply answering in kind to a somewhat pert observation of the hon. Gentleman opposite.