HC Deb 03 December 1953 vol 521 cc1306-8
22. Mr. Ian Harvey

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department why it is not possible, for salary purposes, to equate appointments at the Civil Defence Staff College with those at the Army and Royal Air Force Staff Colleges, respectively, having regard to the fact that he has stated that Civil Defence is the fourth arm of defence.

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

The salaries of the commandant and instructors at the Civil Defence Staff College, like those of the directing staff at the Civil Defence Training Schools, are determined in relation to the general standard of Civil Service remuneration. Senior posts at the Army and Royal Air Force Staff Colleges are held by serving officers on Service rates of pay.

Mr. Harvey

While appreciating the logic of the argument, as my right hon. and learned Friend has already stated the importance of equating the service of Civil Defence with the other military services, may I ask whether it would not now be reasonable to bring them into line?

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

I am sure my hon. Friend will appreciate that when I say, as I have said many times, that Civil Defence is the fourth arm of defence I mean what I say, but it is difficult to equate civil service to Army rates of pay, when those in the Fighting Services hold jobs which are part of the routine of those Services.

23. Mr. Ian Harvey

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department how long the proposed establishment scheme for the directing staff of the Civil Defence Staff College and officers of other civil defence training schools has been under consideration, and when he estimates that he will be able to announce his proposals.

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

I will endeavour to bring the issue of establishment to finality as soon as possible, but until that has been resolved I shall not be able to announce details of any establishment scheme.

Mr. Harvey

Is my right hon. and learned Friend aware that this has been going on for a long time, both since he took office and also under his predecessor, and that it is not encouraging for those who would like to join this important service to feel that they are not part of an established scheme?

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

I realise that there has been pressure for this since the middle of 1951, and I shall do the best I can to resolve the problem.

24. Mr. Ian Harvey

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department what accommodation has been provided for instructors at the Civil Defence Staff College; how many of these instructors are in fact occupying this accommodation; how many are living in private accommodation; and how far the accommodation provided is up to the same standard as that which was originally planned for the college.

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

Seven instructors occupy single quarters in the college, four occupy houses provided in the neighbourhood, and four others occupy private accommodation. The accommodation provided is somewhat below the standard originally planned.

Mr. Harvey

Is my right hon. and learned Friend aware that this Question and the two preceding it are intended to direct his attention to the importance of making this College, which is the key to instruction in Civil Defence, a recognised establishment, and that, unless this is done, a very important part of the Civil Defence organisation is likely to fall below the standards which the rest of the organisation is so easily achieving?

Sir D. Maxwell Fyfe

I very much appreciate the spirit behind these Questions, which is to encourage Civil Defence, but I am sure that my hon. Friend would be the last to desire to give the impression that, although these administrative difficulties are there, the Civil Defence Staff College has, in any way, fallen below the high standard which everyone in the House knows it has attained, and which I am sure it will keep.

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