§ Motion made, and Question proposed, "That this House do now adjourn."—[Mr. Kaberry.]
§ 10.1 p.m.
§ Mr. Ernest Davies (Enfield, East)I make no apology for raising the case of Mr. Edgar Sanders, who was arrested by the Hungarian Government in November, 1949; falsely accused of espionage and sabotage, and convicted and sentenced to a 13 years' term of imprisonment in February, 1950.
I raise this matter for a number of reasons; first, because it is essential that the Hungarian Government should be 160 made aware of the fact that Mr. Sanders is not forgotten; secondly, because: opinion in this country is still strong and. embittered at the treatment that this; innocent man—a British subject—has received and, thirdly, because of the manner in which the Prime Minister dealt with the suggestion which was made by the Hungarian Government for the exchange of Mr. Sanders for the Chinese Communist, Lee Meng, and the manner in which he refused to inform the House of the reasons for the rejection of that offer.
I do not suggest that the offer should have been accepted; there are obvious reasons which might have made it dangerous to do so; but when I asked the Prime Minister to give those reasons he brushed my Question aside—as he did those of other hon. Members—and refused to tell the House why the offer had been rejected. He said that he could not deal with the matter by way of question and answer and suggested that there were other occasions on which it could be raised.
I therefore raise the matter tonight and I ask the Under-Secretary to give the information which the Prime Minister refused on 17th March, and to inform the House why the offer was rejected. The House should know the reasons. I do not say that the offer should necessarily have been accepted, but the House should be taken into the confidence of the Government and informed what is the position. In response to a supplementary question which I put to him the Prime Minister assured the House that the Government would persevere in their efforts to obtain the release of Mr. Sanders, and I should like the Undersecretary to tell the House what has been done since in the way of following up that offer, and to give an assurance that everything possible is being done.
It is fortunate that this matter can be raised at this juncture, because the position has certainly changed since the exchange offer was made. Stalin has died and there has been a certain change in the attitude of the Soviet Union and their satellites towards the Western countries. There have been indications of a desire on the part of the Soviet Union and their satellites for more conciliatory relations with the Western Powers, and in my view this attitude provides a much more favourable opportunity for making every 161 possible effect to obtain the release of Mr. Sanders.
Before I make proposals with which I should like the Under-Secretary to deal, I shall recapitulate the circumstances of this tragic story. The House will remember that in November, 1949, the Hungarian Government arrested three persons who were employed by the International Telegraph and Telephone Company of the United States—Robert Vogler, an American; Imre Geiger, a Hungarian; and Edgar Sanders, a British subject. They were all arrested and imprisoned. Every effort made by the British Legation to communicate with Sanders was rejected by the Hungarian Government. He was also refused the assistance of counsel; the counsel who was employed by the American company was refused a visa.
Journalists were refused visas to attend the trial. One was subsequently able to understand the reason for this because, when the trial took place, the manner in which Edgar Sanders had been conditioned became quite clear. Further, no communication to him from his family or from him to his family has been possible. It was not until 13 weeks after his arrest that he was brought to trial, when he was sentenced to 13 years' imprisonment. Vogler was sentenced to 15 years' imprisonment and Geiger sentenced to death and executed.
The release of the doctors in Moscow shows how much faith we can put in such trials as these. The curtain has now been raised and anyone who had any doubts about the possibility of there being any justification for the arrest and trial of Mr. Sanders must now have had those doubts fully dissipated. His confession of guilt was quite clearly forced upon him in circumstances upon which it is better not to dwell. The whole trial was certainly a brutal farce and, as the Government declared at the time, the evidence which was produced was but a compendium of distortion and lies.
Since Mr. Sanders has been in gaol, he has not been visited by any member of the British Mission in Budapest because the Hungarian Government have refused to permit it. As far as we are aware, no letters or parcels have reached him from this country, and certainly no communication has come from him. In fact, as 162 far as I am aware, it is not known even in which prison he is incarcerated.
immediately after his arrest, the Labour Government of the day broke off trade negotiations which were taking place with the Hungarian Government. Those negotiations were suspended and have not since been resumed, but I regret to say that there is still some trade taking place between this country and Hungary and, if possible, I should like to know the extent of that trade and why it continues as long as Mr. Sanders is still imprisoned and there is no communication with him whatsoever.
I am well aware that even during the time of the Labour Government, and subsequently, there have been efforts to bargain with the Hungarian Government with a view to obtaining Mr. Sanders' release. These negotiations have broken down on every occasion. Perhaps we could be told why it has been impossible for us to reach an agreement with the Hungarians for Mr. Sanders' release in the same way as the Americans succeeded two years ago in getting Mr. Vogler released from prison.
The recent offer of the Hungarian Government to exchange Lee Meng for Mr. Sanders holds out greater hope of the possibility of bringing about his release if the Foreign Office perseveres in its efforts, and follows them up immediately in the light of the present more propitious situation. I think this offer indicates, in the first place—which is certainly encouraging to his family and his friends—that Mr. Sanders is alive and well. If he were not the offer of the exchange would not have been made. In the second place, it indicates that the Hungarian Government are anxious to obtain a means of releasing Mr. Sanders and returning him to this country. I think they are anxious to release him if they can find a way of doing so, because they desire to increase their trade with this country and to restore economic and financial relations with us, which are so strained at the present time.
Further, I think it opens a way to obtain Mr. Sanders' release because it shows that there is a tie up in the Communist world. Of course, we all know there is, but here is an admission by the Russians and the Hungarians of the interrelationship of the Communist world. This shows that the Communist is one 163 world, as it were, because here we have the offer of a Chinese Communist in Malaya for a British subject in prison in Hungary. It provides an opportunity for us to go above the heads of the Hungarian Government, if they refuse now to release Sanders, and to seek the assistance of Moscow itself to intervene with the Hungarians with a view to obtaining his release. We could ask the Russians if they would use their good offices with the Hungarians to bring about the release of Mr. Sanders.
Certainly, there are signs that the Soviet Union and the other Communist States are more anxious to be more conciliatory towards the West. We have the release of the civilians who have been interned in Korea since the outbreak of the Korean war; we have the recent agreement over the release of the sick and wounded prisoners of war in Korea; and, perhaps even more important in this regard, we have the amnesties of the U.S.S.R. and Roumania, and there are rumours of an amnesty in Hungary. There are signs of a change in the Hungarian Government themselves and in their relationship with the West.
I suggest that, in the light of these changed circumstances, and in view of the changed attitude of the Soviet Union and the satellites to the West following Stalin's death, which change may be genuine or may not be, we should instruct the British Ambassador in Moscow to approach Mr. Molotov to ask him to inform Budapest that we are willing to resume trade negotiations immediately with Hungary if Mr. Sanders is released.
I suggest we should make those further concessions which were discussed during the previous negotiations which took place and which, unfortunately, did not come to a successful conclusion. I suggest that it would be well if we did now make this approach to the Russians—that we did it immediately. In view of the uncertainty as to the permanency of any change in attitude on the part of Russia, while the situation is as it is today, if an approach is made now there may be a greater possibility of obtaining a satisfactory outcome than if the matter is delayed.
There is one other request that could easily be made either through the Russian Ambassador in London or in Moscow itself, and that is that the Hungarians 164 should be asked to forward letters from the family of Mr. Sanders and his friends to him in Hungary, and that he should be allowed to send communications from Hungary to his family and friends in this country. It is a small request that I do think it would be difficult for them to refuse if they insist, as they now do, that they desire to have closer and more friendly relations with this country at the present time.
It is tragic that we have become, perhaps, hardened to this flouting of human rights in the Communist States which we have witnessed since the end of the war, and that we have come to tolerate the human suffering which it involves. I therefore appeal to the Government to exploit the present improved atmosphere, and to do everything they can in their power to obtain the release of Mr. Sanders. If the changed attitude of Malenkov and his Government is genuine they cannot refuse to make this approach to the Hungarians, and if they make the approach to the Hungarians it is in their power to ask them to carry out their wishes. If their changed attitude is not genuine, it is quite easy for us to make it clear to them that if they do not obtain Mr. Sanders' release we will not consider their protests of more peaceful intention as sincere, with all that that means.
Edgar Sanders has been languishing in gaol in Hungary, in a foreign country, for three and a half years, convicted of crimes of which he is known to be innocent. He has been refused all communication with the outside world. He has been completely isolated from his family and from his friends. At times, he has been a forgotten man. He must not remain a forgotten man; and he must not be allowed to become a forgotten man again. It is within the power of the Foreign Office—of Her Majesty's Government—to prevent him from so becoming, and that they can do if they continue to press for his release and do not cease in their endeavours to obtain it.
I hope, therefore, that tonight the Under-Secretary will give me an assurance that a new approach will be made to this matter, and that if the Hungarians—whom I hope he will tell us he has again approached since the rejection of the offer to exchange Lee Meng for Mr. Sanders—have not given a satisfactory 165 reply to the further approaches which were made subsequently to the rejection of that offer, then he will go beyond the Hungarians and will give instructions for an approach to be made to the Russian Government asking them to intervene. I ask him to give me that assurance tonight.
§ 10.18 p.m.
§ The Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs (Mr. Anthony Nutting)Not only Her Majesty's Government but the whole House and public opinion outside will, I am sure, share the views which have been expressed by the hon. Member for Enfield, East (Mr. Ernest Davies) about the scandalous, barbarous and uncivilised treatment meted out by the Hungarian Government to Mr. Sanders, who they know, as well as we do, is wholly and entirely innocent of the charges which were brought against him. I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for raising this question tonight and giving me the opportunity to reaffirm Mr. Sanders' innocence, and to set out what Her Majesty's Government and His late Majesty's Government have done, and are continually doing, to secure his release.
First let me deal with the hon. Gentleman's complaint that the Prime Minister, when announcing the Government's decision to reject the Hungarian offer to exchange Mr. Sanders for Lee Meng, gave no reason to the House. Certainly no discourtesy was intended by my right hon. Friend but, as the hon. Gentleman will see from what I have to say, the exchange proposal was a broad question involving some very complicated considerations which my right hon. Friend thought were more the subject for a debate than for question and answer across the Floor of the House.
Of course, Her Majesty's Government did not take such a decision in any light-hearted manner. There were powerful arguments on both sides. On neither side was the argument overwhelming, either for or against the exchange. The decision was taken on balance and principally for two reasons, which I propose to give to the House tonight.
The first was that such an exchange would have provided a dangerous precedent for further bargainings of the same type and might well have encouraged the arrest of other British subjects still living 166 in Communist States as potential hostages. The second reason for rejecting the exchange concerned the position in Malaya. As the Prime Minister explained in answer to a Question on 12th March:
One of the features which should not be overlooked is that there are not two countries but three countries involved in this matter."—[OFFICIAL REPORT, 12th March, 1953: Vol. 512, c. 1503.]As the House is no doubt aware, the prerogative of mercy in the State of Perak where Lee Meng was condemned lies with the Sultan of that State. In the exercise of that prerogative, the Sultan commuted the death sentence on Lee Meng to one of life imprisonment. Any further alteration in her sentence would have involved intervention by Her Majesty's Government and, in the circumstances, such intervention was not considered justified.As the hon. Gentleman will, I feel sure, agree, Her Majesty's Government must always be guided by the interests of good government and sound administration in Malaya, and they cannot feel and do not feel that the proposed exchange was in accordance with those interests. Those were the two reasons which on balance convinced Her Majesty's Government that this exchange proposal should be rejected.
The hon. Gentleman has already recapitulated the history of this tragic case. As he said, Mr. Sanders was arrested and sentenced by a Hungarian court to 13 years' imprisonment on a charge of espionage. The hon. Gentleman asked me to state why it was that the Americans were able to obtain the release of Mr. Vogeler who was arrested with Mr. Sanders and sentenced to 15 years' imprisonment. The answer is that the Americans were able to secure Mr. Vogeler's release in return for a number of concessions of which the principal was the re-opening of the Hungarian consulates in the United States of America. Unfortunately, these concessions are not open, and were not open, to Her Majesty's Government to offer since there are no, and never have been any, Hungarian consulates in the United Kingdom.
I have been asked what we have done to secure Mr. Sanders' release and to state what exchanges have taken place between us and the Hungarians upon this subject. First of all, let me say that the 167 reason for any reticence which may have been shown by Her Majesty's Government regarding these exchanges has always been our anxiety in no way to prejudice Mr. Sanders' case. As the hon. Gentleman knows, we have gone out of our way to discourage public discussion of this matter while negotiations have been proceeding with the Hungarians. Alas, all these negotiations have broken down, but I still claim that the only wise course was to keep them secret while they were going on.
Of course, had we had any information about Mr. Sanders' well-being we should have passed it on to his family, but as the House knows we have never been allowed access to Mr. Sanders and therefore we have had no information to give to his relatives. Indeed, as the hon. Gentleman himself stated, it was because of the Hungarian Government's refusal to allow the British Consul or any British representative to visit Mr. Sanders in prison that in December, 1949, His late Majesty's Government suspended negotiations for a trade and financial agreement with the Hungarian Government. These negotiations have never been resumed and Hungarian imports into the United Kingdom have as a result been virtually excluded. They now consist of a mere trickle amounting to some £12,000 worth a year.
In the reverse direction, we are admittedly sending somewhat more to Hungary, British exports to Hungary amounting to some £700,000 worth a year. What hurts the Hungarians, however, is not the lack of British imports into Hungary but the virtual exclusion of Hungarian imports into the United Kingdom, because this means that the Hungarians are earning no sterling whatever in the United Kingdom market. There is good reason to believe that the ban on Hungarian imports into this country is hurting the Hungarians a good deal more than it is hurting us.
Last May the Government repeated the offer made by the late Government in May, 1950, to resume trade negotiations with Hungary if she would release Mr. Sanders. Discussion of this offer proceeded over a protracted period until December last when the Hungarians finally informed Her Majesty's Minister that they were not prepared to release Mr. Sanders in exchange for economic conces- 168 sions. The breakdown of these discussions was followed by the Hungarian offer on 20th January last to exchange Mr. Sanders for Lee Meng.
As the House will be aware, until Lee Meng's death sentence was commuted there could be no question of agreeing or otherwise to the exchange proposal. The death sentence was commuted on 9th March, and on 17th March the Prime Minister informed the House that Her Majesty's Government had decided to reject the Hungarian offer. I do not think that Her Majesty's Government can be accused of being slow in their consideration of this offer, as has been suggested not by the hon. Gentleman but in other quarters. Having regard to all the considerations that were involved, the constitutional position in Malaya and the possible effect of an exchange upon British subjects in other Communist countries, we had to consult a number of representatives abroad, and I do not think it is lacking in speed if eight days after the sentence of death on Lee Meng was commuted the Government reached and announced its decision in this matter.
I come finally to the hon. Gentleman's suggestion that a new approach should be made to the problem and, in particular, that an approach should be made to the Soviet Government. It may be—and we certainly hope—that the apparent improvement in the atmosphere of Soviet relations with the West will extend to other Communist States in Eastern Europe. I can assure the House that we are carefully watching for any signs of this and we shall lose no opportunity of profiting from an improved atmosphere in Hungary should it materialise. Nothing could lead to an improvement in relations between Hungary and this country more than the release of Mr. Sanders, for, as has been stated again and again in this House, this is the major outstanding issue between the two countries.
But when I am asked to approach the Soviet Union and seek a solution of the matter in Moscow, I must remind the House of the facts of the situation. These are that Hungary is not a constituent State of the Soviet Union with whom we have no diplomatic relations, but a sovereign independent State, and Mr. Sanders is her prisoner. It must be to the Hungarian Government, therefore, that we address ourselves on this matter, as 169 indeed we do on virtually every occasion when Her Majesty's Minister discusses any matter with a representative of the Hungarian Government.
I hope that the House will accept from what I have said tonight that Mr. Sanders is in no way a forgotten man and that the Government have examined every possibility and have taken, and will continue to take, every step open to them to bring pressure to bear to secure his release. We shall, of course, continue our search for a successful outcome to 170 this tragic case, and we shall certainly overlook no means, whatever it may be and whatever the quarter in which it may be sought. We shall certainly overlook no practicable means to this end.
§ The Question having been proposed at Ten o'Clock, and the debate having continued for half an hour, Mr. SPEAKER adjourned the House without Question put, pursuant to the Standing Order.
§ Adjourned at Half-past Ten o'Clock.