HC Deb 27 October 1952 vol 505 cc1564-7
23. Mr. Nabarro

asked the Minister of Transport whether automatic train control of the improved type referred to by the then Minister of Transport in his reply to the hon. Member for Kidderminster on 2nd July, 1951, is in use on the London Midland Region's main line Euston—Rugby, including the Harrow and Wealdstone section; to what extent the automatic signalling and control arrangements exclusively employed by the former Great Western Railway have been adopted and installed by other regions of British Railways; and how the accident rate of the Western Region during the last five years compares with the London Midland Region.

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

No system of automatic train control is in use on the main line between Euston and Rugby.

The system in use on the former Great Western Railway has not been installed on any other region of British Railways.

Information regarding the numbers and types of railway accidents on British Railways is given, region by region, in the annual reports of the Chief Inspecting Officer of Railways. I will send copies of these reports for 1950 and 1951 to my hon. Friend. I am informed that during the four years 1948–51 for each fatal passenger casualty in a train accident on the London Midland Region, nearly 18 million passengers were carried. During the same period there were no fatal passenger casualties on the Western Region.

Mr. Nabarro

Is my right hon. Friend aware that 25 years ago the then Chief Inspecting Officer of Railways, Sir John Pringle, presiding over a Committee appointed by my right hon. Friend's Ministry, strongly recommended the extension of the Great Western system of automatic train control and signalling to all main lines in the country, and that on 2nd July, 1951—only 14 months ago—the Minister of Transport gave me the following reply in this House: The automatic train control system of the old Great Western Railway Company has not been altered, and the wider extension of automatic train control of an improved type, which is now under large-scale experiment, has been accepted as desirable by the British Transport Commission."—[OFFICTAL REPORT, 2nd July. 1951; Vol. 489, c. 1880–81.] In those circumstances, may we inquire what has been done during the last 16 months?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

I have no doubt that the whole matter of automatic train control will pass under the most search-inv review by the Chief Inspecting Officer.

Mr. Ernest Davies

If there has been any slackness or neglect in this respect in the past, is it not because the privately-owned railways did not extend the system?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

I am sure that most of us would deplore any attempt to fasten blame on any one ideology, or the other. The whole matter will be exhaustively examined by the Chief Inspecting Officer, and I urge the House to wait until his report is completed.

Mr. Assheton

Is it not the case that the system employed by the Great Western Railway is not necessarily likely to be suitable on lines which are frequently interfered with by snow?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

That has been said in some quarters, and that is the sort of matter upon which I rely on Colonel Wilson's judgment.

25. Mr. G. Wilson

asked the Minister of Transport if he will direct the British Transport Commission, under Section 4 of the Transport Act, 1947, to consider the desirability of making obligatory on all British main line railways the safety device known as automatic train control at present in use only on Western Region.

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

No, Sir. I am awaiting the report of the Chief Inspecting Officer. I should point out, however, that the British Transport Commission are giving immediate consideration, in the light of experiments which have been going on for some time, to the initiation of a practical programme for the extension of automatic train control on British Railways.

Mr. Wilson

In considering any alternative schemes of automatic train control, will my right hon. Friend bear in mind that the Great Western system of warning continues to operate in the event of an electrical failure?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

I am sure that no review will ever leave in any doubt the great obligation we are under to the pioneers of the Great Western Railway for the work they did.

28. Mr. Sparks

asked the Minister of Transport if, in connection with the recent railway accident at Harrow, he will use his statutory powers regarding investigation of accidents to inquire and report when the first practical use of automatic train control was adopted on the former Great Western and London Midland and Scottish Railways; and if he will also inquire and report into the reasons for the slow extension of the system throughout the main trunk lines of British Railways.

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

The two points to which the hon. Member refers are receiving the attention of the Chief Inspecting Officer of Railways during the course of his inquiry into the recent accident at Harrow, and they will be dealt with in his report.

Mr. Sparks

Can the right hon. Gentleman give us an assurance that that report will be placed in the Library for the information of all hon. Members, because it is a very important matter in view of the prolonged delays that have taken place in the extension of this system of safety? Is the Minister also aware that over the years many disasters have been caused as a result of the absence of this system, and that it is most important that action should be taken to speed it up?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

I and my predecessors for 80 years have been under the statutory obligation to make these reports public, and I will give this report the widest possible publicity.

Mr. H. Morrison

As Questions Nos. 23, 25 and 28 deal with the same subject, would it not have saved the time of the House if the Minister had answered them together, as is the general practice?

Mr. Lennox-Boyd

They do not deal exclusively with the same point. Although they deal with the same tragic disaster, they concern different aspects of it, and I thought, in view of the frightful loss of life and the immense importance of this subject, that it was worth while to take up the time of Parliament a little longer to deal with it.