HC Deb 14 November 1951 vol 493 cc1127-36

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That this House do now adjourn."—[Mr. Drewe.]

10.44 p.m.

Mr. Frederick Peart (Workington)

I wish to raise a matter particularly affecting my own constituency—the supply of electricity to Borrowdale. Many hon. Members have visited the Lake District and especially the lovely valley of Borrow-dale itself, and they will realise that I am fortunate in having in my constituency some of the loveliest scenery in the world, which, year after year, attracts visitors from all over Great Britain and Overseas.

Although my constituents cater for the enjoyment of visitors, they themselves do not enjoy all the services to which they are entitled. The valley needs a modern electricity supply. Hotels, homes, and farms want electricity for heating, lighting, and labour-saving devices. Some hotels in the valley have their own d.c. supply generated from individual generating plants, but it is not adequate for every modern electrical appliance.

Borrowdale has 130 houses, including five hotels, three hostels, 20 farms, and a slate quarry. From the national point of view it is a great heritage, with its wonderful scenery, and that is why I claim Borrowdale is a special case. I do not wish to become involved in political controversy, but one of the most formidable arguments for the nationalisation of electricity was that areas such as Borrowdale could be treated as special cases. If the community accepts responsibility for the supply and distribution of electricity, then the old argument of profitability cannot be sustained.

An electricity scheme for Borrowdale was prepared 14 years ago. It was submitted by the old Mid-Cumberland Electricity Coy. I understand that it was vigorously opposed and aroused considerable controversy on the amenity issue. I do not wish to revive the, old argument or to give undue publicity to those crank organisations who would still have some of my constituents enduring the conditions of the Middle Ages. I stress the right of my constituents in Borrowdale to enjoy those basic services that are essential to the well-being of a modern community.

In March, 1950, after representations were made to me by the Borrowdale Parish Council, I raised the whole question with my right hon. Friend, the then Minister of Fuel and Power, who, with his intimate knowledge of the valley, expressed sympathy. I was informed, however, that the distribution of electricity was a matter of day-to-day administration by the North-Western Electricity Board, and that the general question of distribution by means of overhead lines in areas of particular beauty or national interest had been considered in connection with the National Parks and Access to the Countryside Acts of 1949.

It was argued then that in certain areas of exceptional beauty, such as Borrowdal,e, the amenity interest must prevail, and in such circumstances it has to be decided whether the additional cost of placing lines underground might not make the scheme for distribution completely uneconomic.

As a result of my representations to the Minister, correspondence was forwarded to the Consultative Council for the area of the North-Western Board. This council has statutory powers to consider any matter affecting the distribution of electricity in the area. On 4th October I received a very courteous and detailed reply from the chairman of the North-Western Electricity Consultative Council, Alderman Wright Robinson, who informed me that he had just received the official decision by the North-Western Board on the supply of electricity to Borrowdale.

If I may quote from the letter: At their meeting on 11th September, 1950, the Board considered a report on the proposed scheme to supply Borrowdale, and decided that for the time being the scheme must be deferred. The Board appreciate that this decision will cause some disappointment but they felt that having regard to the present capital restrictions they had no alternative. The letter went on: Your Council will realise that the present time the Board must expend capital for the benefit of the greatest number of consumers, and also have full regard to national considerations which require full production from industry and agriculture. The matter will not, however, be lost sight of and the position will he reviewed from time to time, but it is impossible at present to give any indication as to when it will proceed. I trust that this evening the Parliamentary Secretary—whom I should like to congratulate on his appointment—will give a sympathetic reply, and that he will agree that the position of Borrowdale should be reviewed now, and that he will make the necessary representations through his Department to the North-West Electricity Board. The Board, in their reply to the chairman of the council, stress the needs of agriculture. Well, Borrowdale has 20 farms, and they do make an effective contribution to national agricultural production.

I stress, too, the importance of the growing tourist industry. Borrowdale is a special case for it is a national beauty spot attracting thousands of visitors each year. Electricity is important for our hotels and the comfort of visitors, but, above all, it is vital to the men and women who live in the valley for it is they who look after the valley for the nation. I am certain my constituents deserve special treatment and the right to enjoy with others all the advantages of a modern electricity supply.

It may be argued by people who oppose a scheme for Borrowdale that the cost is too high. I understand that the cost of such a scheme would be in the region of over£30,000, but when we look at the accounts and reports of the British Electricity Authority and the reports for the area board we see in the year ending 31st March, 1951, the Authority had a net surplus of over£6,000,000 and a trading profit of£27,070,925. If we examine the accounts for the board in question for the same period there was a trading surplus of£865,819. Although there was a deficit of£138,187 due to interest charges they had actually a balance for the year of over£142,000. In other words, when one thinks of what the scheme for Borrowdale will cost, it is really negligible in comparison with what is being made out of electricity by the nation.

Tonight, I hope that our case will be carefully considered and I know that the Minister, who probably knows this area, will give it that sympathy we request, and that representations will be made to the regional board so that this scheme can be reconsidered, and that my constituents can have those services to which they are entitled.

10.54 p.m.

Mr. W. M. F. Vane (Westmorland)

I am very glad that the hon. Member for Workington (Mr. Pearl) has raised this question of electricity supplies to an isolated dale on the edge of the Lake District. I know this district—and probably every hon. Gentleman also knows it and loves its beauty. But those who live in that area—and I live not so far away, in a place still waiting for electricity—feel that over the last few years we have not had our fair share of this development.

We know that there are certain forces weighted against us, but we maintain that Switzerland, which probably has a tourist industry more highly developed than our own, has managed to combine the bringing of electricity to the most isolated dwellings without harming the natural beauty of the country, and without killing that tourist goose which lays such big and such golden eggs.

The hon. Member for Workington spoke of special treatment. I would not ask for special treatment, but only for the same treatment as all other people and places expect to get. I hope that the Parliamentary Secretary will clear up this position and tell us exactly what is short. If one approaches either the North-Western or any other electricity board on a case of this sort, sometimes one is told that the difficulty is the shortage of capital—although that, I think, has just been explained away—and at others that it is the shortage of materials. One excuse after another is put forward.

I for one am not prepared to believe that everything that ought to be done is being done. If, for example, new houses are built, maybe on the edge of Keswick, or in one of the bigger villages, they probably have gas and electricity connected at once. But if one lives in Borrowdale, or, for example, in the village where I live and where we have been in the queue for 20 years waiting for the electric main to be brought to us, we are told that we have carried on so long with lamps that really it will not matter if we go on using them a little longer.

I do not think that the priorities are right, and I hope that the Parliamentary Secretary will accept our contention that it is necessary in a district such as Borrowdale, to extend the necessary services which need not injure amenities at all.

10.57 p.m.

The Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Fuel and Power (Mr. L. W. Joynson-Hicks)

The one thing at least that I have in common, both with the hon. Member for Workington (Mr. Peart), who raised this question, and, if I may say so, raised it with extreme courtesy and good humour—I appreciated his having let me know in advance the points he was going to make—and also in common with my hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland (Mr. Vane), is that I also live in a place which has no main electricity. Therefore, I can assure them from the outset that they have my personal sympathy in their problems.

The hon. Member for Workington also knows that I share his views about farming and in the last Parliament we, on opposite sides of the House, worked considerably together in the interests of farming. I appreciate immensely, both from the general as well as the personal point of view, the desirability of bringing main electricity to the agricultural communities. I would say, in reply to the hon. Gentleman, that he is not alone in enjoying lovely scenery. We have some very lovely scenery in Sussex, too, and we have to protect that as well. Therefore, his problem at one end of the country is very familiar to me from my knowledge of the other.

So far as the present situation is concerned, I think it is appreciated that any decision about the supplying of electricity to any particular area rests with the area electricity board, in this case the North-Western Electricity Board, and it is not a matter for my right hon. Friend as Minister of Fuel and Power to decide in a particular case whether or not electricity should be taken there. As far as the North-Western Electricity Board is concerned, there is no doubt whatever that they are very fully aware of their duties and obligation to bring the electricity to the rural areas, and, in fact, they have made considerable progress in that direction. I think it can safely be claimed that as much electricity has been brought to the rural areas by that board as by any other board.

The problem is one which is fraught with many difficulties, and in this particular case they fall mainly under two headings. The first difficulty is the limitation of capital expenditure and capital investment and my hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland (Mr. Vane) will recall that there was considerable stress laid on that aspect of affairs by the last Government. So far as it has been possible for me to ascertain at the present time, the stress is no less urgent now than it was then. When my hon. Friend asks what is short, I think the answer is, so far as was have been able to ascertain, that everything is short, in particular the actual labour and materials. The effect which the capital expenditure would have upon many other industries and development problems must also be considered.

I do not disagree with the statement which the hon. Gentleman read from the Minister of Fuel and Power in the last Administration. I think he put the matter very well indeed. It is necessary when there is a limited amount of capital to be spent in the development of projects for the boards concerned to have regard to the number of people who will benefit from it. It is also true there has to be regard in the present state of national affairs to the amount of production benefit which will accrue from capital expenditure. And in this case for an expenditure of some£30,000 we shall benefit directly somewhere in the region of 120 people. The hon. Gentleman mentioned a direct number of 130 people who would benefit.

Mr. Peart

It was 130 houses which mentioned, and not people; 130 houses, 5 hotels, 3 hostels, 20 farms and a slate quarry. Then there is the tourist trade, so that it is much more than 130 people. In fact, it will affect thousands of visitors.

Mr. Joynson-Hicks

I quite appreciate the indirect benefit which would accrue to visitors and tourists. I should perhaps have said consumers instead of people, the actual people who will pay the bills for the electricity taken to these farms. Be that as it may, my information was 110, and I thought that I was giving the hon. Member the benefit of the doubt in approximately splitting the figure between himself and myself at 120. However it may be, the direct number of consumers is comparatively small for the amount of expenditure involved.

That is a matter which must necessarily be taken into account by the Board when they consider a matter of this sort. The hon. Gentleman will realise, as will my hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland, that this is by no means an isolated case. There are many competing claims for the development of electrical installations. It is an obligation on the parts of these boards to run their businesses properly, and it is exceedingly difficult to see how this can be made a profitable installation unless there is laid upon the consumers a very substantial charge for the introduction of electricity to their homes and farms and hotels. Whether or not the charge will be one which they will be agreeable to accept is a matter about which I have no knowledge.

So far as the finances of the Board are concerned, I am not in a position to follow the hon. Gentleman into the particulars of the balance sheet of the British Electricity Authority, but as far as the North-Western Board are concerned his figures are quite correct. The Board refer to this matter in their Report, and they state, if I may quote, that the year's financial results show that the activities for the year resulted in a deficit of£138,000. They go on to say that it was a year of rising prices in almost all commodities and there were national wage awards which increased costs. There were also considerable increases in the price of electricity purchased from the British Electricity Authority. The upshot of that is that it seems to me very unlikely that the estimates for the introduction of electricity, even at the figure of£30,000 which the hon. Gentleman gave, would not be realised when the work was carried out. One must have regard to the possibility that there would be an even more substantial outlay than that.

There is also the difficulty of the method of introducing electricity into the area. If it could be done by overhead lines it would be very much cheaper than if the lines had to be taken underground. I think the hon. Gentleman's figure was based on the assumption that overhead lines would be used but, as he very rightly said, there are people who object to overhead lines in beauty spots, as in an area like this. That is a matter for the Board to decide, and I have little doubt that it would be a matter upon which they would seek the opinion not only of national organisations but of people who know the district best and who live there.

Mr. Peart

Would they seek the views of the Borrowdale Parish Council and the Cockermouth Rural Council, because they are the people who are there, and not take too much notice of outside organisations who have grossly interfered with this area in the past?

Mr. Joynson-Hicks

That is not for me to say, but I have little doubt that if the hon. Gentleman approached them on those lines they would accede to any reasonable request he made. The interest of the Minister would arise if and when an application was made to him to lay overhead lines, and that is a decision which my right hon. Friend would have to take. If it came to that issue I am sure we should appreciate and welcome the opinion of the hon. Gentleman himself, and he would have to guide us.

Whether we should follow his guidance or not would be a matter for my right hon. Friend to decide, but we should appreciate his guidance on whether electricity should be brought underground or whether overhead lines should be used. He would have to weigh the balance for his constituents—whether they preferred to have the electricity at a reasonable price or whether they preferred not to have the possibility of the beauty of their countryside being desecrated. That is a fair and reasonable thing on which a Member of Parliament should advise a Minister, as it concerns his constituents.

In summing up, I would say that we appreciate the arguments although this has been a case of special pleading by the hon. Gentleman—to which I take no exception; although I do take exception to my hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland, who raised exactly the same argument but said it was not special pleading. We recognise the strength of the argument. We are particularly anxious to help the farmers and we are anxious to maintain the amenities. In particular, the Board are anxious to fulfil their duty of bringing electricity to the rural areas, but at present the limitation on capital expenditure makes it impossible to embark upon any of these schemes, whether it be this one or any other scheme in a similar category.

I have given the reasons—the question of the result on productivity and the question of the number of people who will immediately benefit; those points have to be taken into account. I can only say that, while I am not in a position to hold out any hopes to the hon. Member who raised this issue, it is one in which I personally feel considerable sympathy; and I look forward to the time when the general situation of the country is sufficiently improved to allow us to embark on schemes of this sort.

Question put, and agreed to.

Adjourned accordingly at Ten Minutes past Eleven o'Clock.