Road and Bridge Tolls (Hansard, 23 October 1950)

§ 2. Mr. Shepherd
asked the Minister of Transport the number of toll bridges and roads now operating under the nationalised transport system; and if he will give the number of roads and bridges under this control which have been freed from toll since nationalisation.

§ Mr. Barnes
The answer to the first part of the Question is 10 toll bridges and two toll roads: the answer to the second part is "None."

§ Mr. Shepherd
Does not the Minister feel that it is disgraceful that the State should take over these undertakings and perpetuate road and bridge tolls? Are the public to get nothing out of nationalisation but higher fares?

§ Mr. Barnes
I do not consider that it is a disgraceful state of affairs. The hon. Member will recollect that the Chancellor of the Exchequer indicated some time ago some of the directions in which economy should be attained, and this was one that he specifically mentioned. That being so, I am unable at present to make any grant in that direction.

§ 13. Colonel Crosthwaite-Eyre
asked the Minister of Transport if he will make a further statement about the freeing of Lymington toll bridge, consequent upon the negotiation between the Hampshire County Council and the Railway Executive.

§ Mr. Barnes
I am informed by the British Transport Commission that there have been no recent negotiations between the Railway Executive and the Hampshire County Council for the freeing of Lymington toll bridge. Grants towards the cost of extinguishing tolls cannot be made at present, but I propose to consult the British Transport Commission and the Hampshire County Council as to whether it would be practicable to arrive at a settlement which could be implemented when such grants again become available.

§ Colonel Crosthwaite-Eyre
In view of such grants being available, may I ask is the Minister aware that the Railway Executive have said they have no statutory authority to free such tolls and is not this another case 2459 where the public are being penalised in order that the losses of the Railway Executive can be minimised? Will the right hon. Gentleman take action about it?

§ Mr. Barnes
No, Sir, I do not think that conclusion is correct. I can understand that possibly there has been no anxiety to proceed with these negotiations because both bodies are aware that at the moment I cannot make a grant. That was the reason why, in my reply, I said that I would bring them together to see if they can agree, so that when grants are available there will be no further delay.

§ Colonel Crosthwaite-Eyre
Following that further information, will the Minister say when these grants will be made available because, on his own statement, until they are available nothing can be done? Will he give us some idea of the time limit?

§ Mr. Barnes
As the hon. and gallant Member is aware, my Departmental Vote is granted year by year, and I cannot anticipate what my Vote will be in the future.

§ Sir Peter Macdonald
As legislation exists giving county councils powers to take over these toll bridges and roads, should not the question of grants go to arbitration? Surely it could be settled by a loan, a grant being given at a later date. There is no reason to hold the matter up.

§ Mr. Barnes
No, Sir, I do not think that the local authorities would proceed on that basis.