HC Deb 02 March 1949 vol 462 cc337-40
14. Mr. Rankin

asked the Secretary of State for Air what co-ordination of flight plans he is maintaining between the Royal Air Force and civil aircraft.

16. Mr. Emrys Hughes

asked the Secretary of State for Air what regulations exist instructing Royal Air Force training aircraft to avoid regular routes of civilian aircraft; and to what extent the Royal Air Force co-operates with civil aviation ground control.

19. Mr. Scollan

asked the Secretary of State for Air, in view of the recent accident at Coventry, what steps are being taken to keep military planes from exercising on civil aviation services routes.

Mr. A. Henderson

As the answer is somewhat long, I will circulate a statement in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Mr. Rankin

Could my right hon. and learned Friend say whether the statement he proposes to issue will indicate whether, if any interchange of communication is made between the two Air Forces, that information is immediate?

Mr. Henderson

The reason why my reply is so long that I prefer, with permission, to circulate it, is because I have set out fairly fully the details of the organisation which has been set up to cover these matters between the Ministry of Civil Aviation and the Royal Air Force. I would not be able to say that the reply indicates that the information is passed immediately, but I assume that there is a sufficient degree of efficiency to justify the acceptance of the statement.

Mr. Emrys Hughes

In view of the fact that this Question and Question No. 19 refer to a specific accident, will the Minister assure us that there will be a full public court of inquiry into the loss of these aeroplanes, as was the case with the loss of the Dutch liner at Prestwick?

Mr. Hendersons

The question of a court of public inquiry is a matter for the Ministry of Civil Aviation, but an inquiry is taking place and, in addition, there is the Service court of inquiry which is being held under King's Regulations.

Mr. Scollan

I would like to ask the Minister why the second part of my Question No. 19, which asks what steps are being taken to keep military planes from exercising on civil aviation services routes, cannot be answered without circulating the reply?

Mr. Hendersons

I am quite prepared to give that part of the reply. In view of the fact that training aircraft may be required to fly long distances over land, and that the area of this country is limited in extent, it is not always practicable to route training aircraft away from civil aviation routes.

Mr. Scollan

Is the Minister aware that at the present time not long distance distance flights, but ordinary exercises, mean that planes are coming up through the cloud ceiling not 50 yards from the ordinary civil plane flying down to London from Renfrew, and that could obviously be stopped under the long distance flights he mentions.

Mr. Henderson

I am not prepared to accept, without further evidence, that that is the case.

Mr. Scollan

I have seen it.

Following is the statement:

In view of the fact that training aircraft may be required to fly long distances over land and that the area of this country is limited in extent, it is not always practicable to route training aircraft away from civil aviation routes. All aircraft are at all times bound to observe the rules and regulations framed to secure the safety of aircraft in flight, and in conditions of good visibility these regulations by themselves provide adequate safeguards against the danger of collision. In bad visibility, however, or when R.A.F. aircraft have to pass through control zones, or in other special circumstances which are detailed below, their flight plans are communicated to the Air Traffic Control Centres.

For air traffic control purposes the United Kingdom is divided into five Flight Information Regions, each of which is controlled by one Air Traffic Control Centre. At each Air Traffic control Centre there is a combined R.A.F. and Ministry of Civil Aviation staff who work in the same control room and who are responsible for co-ordinating the movements of R.A.F. and civil aircraft in accordance with information regarding flight plans supplied to them.

The procedure is for flight plans submitted by the R.A.F. and civil aircraft to be forwarded to the Air Traffic Control Centre of the Flight Information Region in which the aerodrome of departure is located. This A.T.C.C. passes the relevant information to the Air Traffic Control Centre in the Flight Information Region at which the aircraft intends to land and/or over which it intends to fly. The information is not, however, passed to other civil or military aerodromes, nor in fact would such a procedure be possible. Both civil and R.A.F. flight plans are treated in precisely the same manner by the Air Traffic Control Centres.

Flight plans are submitted by R.A.F. aircraft, including training aircraft, in the following circumstances:

  1. (a) If the flight is scheduled to pass through, or land at an airfield in a Control Zone (e.g. the area round places such as London, Manchester and Liverpool in which there is a high density of air traffic.
  2. (b) If the flying involves night flying without lights, cloud flying, air firing or bombing, etc., or is in other respects hazardous, or if conditions of visibility are poor.
  3. (c) If the flight is outside the United Kingdom.

The procedure for air traffic control is constantly under review by the Air Ministry and Ministry of Civil Aviation with a view to effecting any possible improvements.