Groundnuts Scheme (Hansard, 14 February 1949)

§ 33. Mr. Hurd
asked the Minister of Food if he is satisfied that the 1949 cropping programme for the groundnuts scheme in East Africa will conserve the fertility of the soil and prevent soil erosion after the bush has been cleared.

§ Mr. Strachey
Yes, Sir. As the hon. Member knows, comprehensive measures are being taken to prevent soil erosion and maintain fertility.

§ Mr. Hurd
Will the right hon. Gentleman allow the House to share one of his secrets about the groundnuts scheme, and that is what crops are actually being grown in order to attain this purpose?

§ Mr. Strachey
This year groundnuts and sunflowers have been planted, but of course the preservation of soil fertility and anti-erosion measures depend upon the crop rotation over a number of years.

§ Mr. J. H. Hare
Can the right hon. Gentleman tell us whether any lessons can be drawn from the very small area of ground where groundnuts have been grown for two years?

§ Mr. Strachey
I think that the scientific advisers of the Corporation would say that it was shown that it is safe to grow groundnuts for at least two years in succession, but they would not go further than that.

§ 42. Mr. Hurd
asked the Minister of Food if he will expedite the publication of the first annual report of the Overseas Food Corporation; and how soon after 31st March the House may expect to see the accounts of the groundnuts scheme in East Africa.

§ Mr. Strachey
I rely on the Corporation to submit the report and accounts as soon as they reasonably can, having regard to the normal practice of large commercial undertakings in this matter. I cannot commit them to a particular date.

§ Mr. Hurd
Does that mean that the House may not see the report and accounts until possibly October or November, or even after the General Election?

§ Mr. Strachey
Oh, no, long before the Election, but I cannot really add to my answer at this stage.

§ Mr. J. H. Hare
Surely the right hon. Gentleman is aware of the intense public interest in this matter? Is it not possible for him to produce a White Paper or some other document in order to keep the public informed?

§ Mr. Strachey
I have already stated to the House that I would welcome the Debate which I understood was going to be arranged through hon. and right hon. Gentlemen opposite on this matter at as early a date as they like.

§ Mr. Lennox-Boyd
If the right hon. Gentleman is to supply information to the House during a Debate, will he not make that information available in advance so as to give us an opportunity of studying the position?

§ Mr. Strachey
I can only repeat what I said on an earlier occasion. I am not willing to ask the Corporation to supply an additional report in the middle of the first year of their operations, as well as their first annual report. Apart from that, I am being asked to publish my speech in writing in advance, which is quite a novel custom for this House.

§ Sir Peter Macdonald
As the right hon. Gentleman has promised a report, can he say why we should not have it now?

§ Mr. Strachey
I promised that this information would be ready at any time for a Debate on this subject if hon. Members opposite, through the usual channels, would arrange a date.

§ 43. Mr. Hurd
asked the Minister of Food if schools are now being provided for the children of workers on the groundnuts scheme in East Africa as part of the welfare activities of the Overseas Food Corporation; what proportion of the children are attending; if there are facilities for adult education; and what is the estimated cost.

§ 34 and 35. Sir John Barlow
asked the Minister of Food (1) what medical facilities are provided for the Africans employed on the groundnuts scheme at Kongwa; what proportion have received medical attention during the last six convenient months; and what are the most prevalent diseases;
775 (2) what measures have now been taken at Kongwa to improve the recreational facilities of the Africans employed on the groundnuts scheme.

§ Mr. Strachey
I have requested the Overseas Food Corporation, who are responsible for these matters, to reply to the hon. Member's Questions direct.

§ Mr. Hurd
Is it not the responsibility of this House and of the Minister to take particular care of the welfare of the Africans employed on this scheme?

§ Mr. Strachey
Yes, Sir, it is part of the responsibilities of all of us to do that, but it has been clearly laid down that these Questions, which go into very considerable detail, should be answered direct from the public Corporation; again, all these matters can be arranged in our forthcoming Debate on the subject.

§ Mr. Joynson-Hicks
Is the right hon. Gentleman suggesting that the Overseas Food Corporation is the educational authority for that area?

§ Mr. Strachey
No, Sir; that shows the width of these Questions, some of which no doubt are the responsibility of the Tanganyika Government, which should be inquired into through my right hon. Friend the Colonial Secretary.

§ Sir W. Smithers
Is the Minister aware that this morning I have had a most unsatisfactory letter from the Overseas Food Corporation, but that the point really is that this letter will not appear in HANSARD, and that I am the only person who will get that information?

Mr. H. D. Hughes
Is my right hon. Friend aware that this is not a satisfactory situation, because many hon. Members on all sides of the House would be interested in this type of information, and it is not practicable for us all to write to the Corporation? If it can be arranged for the hon. Member for Newbury (Mr. Hurd) to have this information, cannot it be made available to all?

§ Mr. Strachey
If the Question is one which seems to us and to the Chair, with respect to you, Mr. Speaker, to be within the Ruling which has been laid down for the future in Debates on this subject, I do answer it, as I answered the Question put down by the hon. Member just now. As for the kind of Question relating 776 to matters of detail which the public Corporation should answer, the other procedure is taken; but this House can have that information in the forthcoming Debate.

§ Mr. R. A. Butler
Does the right hon. Gentleman realise that he has said that he is ready to answer questions in Debate and have them included in HANSARD, but that he is not prepared to answer Questions now? How does he differentiate between the two?

§ Mr. Strachey
I must follow the line agreed to. A Ruling has been given in regard to all the public Corporations, and I cannot deviate from it.

§ Mrs. Leah Manning
Does my right hon. Friend not remember that this particular matter raised in Question 43 was discussed in Committee, when he promised us very definitely that these schools would be extended as the work of the Corporation proceeded and that children would not have to wait for education? Can he tell us whether that policy has been carried out?

§ Mr. Strachey
I am perfectly willing to say that educational facilities, provided on the part of the Tanganyika Government and the Corporation, are extending as rapidly as possible.

§ Sir Ralph Glyn
Does not the right hon. Gentleman think that the Colonial Office has some responsibility, in this matter, and is it necessary that there should be two authorities responsible for education in the Colonies?

§ Mr. Strachey
That is a question on which the Corporation feels strongly, and wishes these responsibilities to be borne as much as practicable by the Tanganyika Government.

§ Mr. Driberg
Would my right hon. Friend bear in mind the fact that, when replies are given in the winding-up speech at the end of a Debate to points raised in it, they are often of a general and perfunctory kind, and necessarily so, whereas the particular replies asked for in these Questions would be full and precise? Would he therefore make inquiries from the Corporation himself and circulate the answers which he receives from the Corporation in HANSARD?

§ Mr. Hurd
On a point of Order. May I appeal to you, Mr. Speaker, to have this matter made clear? These two questions were, in fact, addressed to the Secretary of State for the Colonies. I think it would be most helpful if we could have some clear Ruling.

§ Mr. Driberg
Further to that point of Order. Are we not still awaiting your final Ruling, Mr. Speaker, and a further debate on this matter of Questions regarding the Overseas Food Corporation?

§ Mr. Speaker
With regard to a further Debate, I have no knowledge. As to a further Ruling, I considered the matter very carefully and I came to the conclusion that there was nothing further to be done, because there was no complaint that any Questions had not been allowed by the Table and that is all I am concerned with. So far they have all been allowed. How Ministers answer Questions is not a matter that concerns me. The Question put down by the hon. Member which he says was transferred was, I presume, transferred by the Table to the right Department, and it was considered that the right Department was the Ministry of Food, and not the Colonial Office. Such Questions are transferred automatically to the right Department by the Table, and that has always been our custom.

§ Mr. Driberg
With regard to what you have just said, Mr. Speaker, can we take it at least that questions on the lines of those allowed today will continue to be allowed by the Table, so that we can continue to chivy my right hon. Friend if he does not give full and satisfactory answers?

§ Mr. Speaker
I cannot say what the future attitude to such Questions will be, or whether they will be allowed. Those put down for today have been allowed, but whether any future Questions will be allowed I cannot prophesy.

§ Mr. Godfrey Nicholson
Surely, this is becoming rather ridiculous. Nobody can seriously declare that education is the business of any Corporation, yet Questions about education are bandied about from one Department to another and hon. Members are being referred to a Corporation which may or may not answer them Surely, some Ruling should be given which would ensure that the hon.
778 Member who is asking the Question shall know who is responsible and be able to get an answer?

§ Mr. Speaker
I cannot rule how an answer should be given. All I can say is whether a Question shall be put or not. What the Minister may do, or whether he is going to answer or not, has nothing to do with me at all.

Mr. H. D. Hughes
Would it be possible for you to give further consideration to this problem, Mr. Speaker? We are in the position that hon. Members are instructed to write to the Corporation and receive information which would he of interest to a large number of other hon. Members in the House. Would it be practicable for you to give consideration to some means whereby the information made available to one hon. Member could be made available automatically to all hon. Members of the House?

§ Mr. Speaker
I remember that, on the Christmas Adjournment, the Leader of the House suggested that we might have a further Debate on these matters, and perhaps this is a matter which might he debated. I will certainly give the matter my consideration, but I am not in the position to give instructions to Ministers as to how they must answer Questions; that is not part of the Speaker's duty. Where a Minister thinks the Question is so important that he would like to publish the answer of the Corporation in HANSARD, that is a matter entirely for him, and has nothing to do with me.