§ 10. Mr. Joynson-Hicksasked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that chairmen of local authorities claim that he has granted dispensation to councillors who are connected with the cooperative movement enabling them to vote upon a motion for the transfer of the 1311 authority s banking account to a co-operative society; what are the terms of such dispensation; and under what authority is it given.
§ Mr. BevanMy predecessors and I have granted a number of dispensations of this kind under the authority of Section 76 (8) of the Local Government Act, 1933. The terms of the dispensation are not always the same, but if the hon. Member has any particular case in mind, I shall be glad to send him a copy.
§ Mr. Joynson-HicksDo we understand from that answer that the right hon. Gentleman only grants dispensations in specific cases? If that is so, will he give an assurance that in no case will he grant dispensations where the disability imposed upon members does not reduce them to less than a quorum?
§ Mr. BevanNo, Sir. I cannot do that. I am under an obligation by Statute to act in a semi-judicial capacity. Therefore, I cannot give a ruling in any hypothetical case.
§ Squadron-Leader FlemingIn view of the fact that these co-operative councillors are directly interested in this matter, would it not be far better, in the interests of the public. that they should abstain from voting?
§ Mr. BevanIf the hon. Member will read the terms of my reply, he will find that both I and all my predecessors have found it necessary to issue dispensations. If he will examine the Local Government Bill, which is now before the House, he will see that we are removing this nonsense.
§ Mr. Lennox-BoydHas the dispensation ever been extended to councillors who are paid employees of the co-operative movement?
§ Mr. BevanIf the hon. Member will put down a Question, I will endeavour to give him an answer if the information is available.
§ Mr. Joynson-HicksMay I ask whether In the case referred to in the original Question, a similar dispensation has also been given to members connected with the bank to which the banking account is proposed to be moved?
§ Mr. BevanIf the hon. Member will look at the Bill, he will see that we are amending the situation.
§ Major Guy LloydIf the right hon. Gentleman is acting in a semi-judicial capacity in this matter, is it right that he should tell the House that he thinks it is all "nonsense"?
§ 14. Mr. William Shepherdasked the Minister of Health why he gave permission to co-operative society members of the Manchester City Council to vote on the issue of granting shops to the cooperative society on the Baguley Hall estate; and whether he received a request in writing from the interested councillors.
§ Mr. BevanThe answer to the first part of the Question is because it appeared to me to be in the interests of the inhabitants of the area; and to the second part is "Yes."
§ Mr. ShepherdIs it not a fact that the dispensation granted caused the original recommendation to be overthrown in open council? Has the Minister considered the attitude of private traders, and does he not realise that they cannot feel they are having a square deal when the council chamber is packed with interested voters?
§ Mr. BevanI cannot make any comment on the decision of a local authority. All I can decide is whether the dispensation was or was not justified in the circumstances, and I believe it was.
§ Squadron-Leader FlemingDoes the Minister make any inquiries, before he grants these dispensations, to see whether the co-operative councillors are paid employees?
§ Mr. BevanThat is entirely irrelevant at the moment. The question is whether or not I can, under the Statute, reasonably grant a dispensation. I do grant dispensations, as did my predecessors on very many occasions.