HC Deb 16 February 1944 vol 397 cc165-7
26. Captain Strickland

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of War Transport whether he is aware that, on 5th February, seven motor-lorries were instructed by his Department to proceed empty from O. N. Transport Company, Limited, and A. E. Taylor and Company, Limited, London to Warrington, about 1,500 unloaded vehicle-miles, and that one of these on reaching Warrington was loaded with empty second-hand packing cases to be delivered to a timber yard in Birmingham; and whether he will inform the House of the carriage cost involved in this latter case, including wages.

Mr. Noel-Baker

I am making inquiries, and will write to my hon. and gallant Friend as soon as I can.

Captain Strickland

Is my hon. Friend aware that a few minutes ago the First Lord of the Admiralty stated that the Government's policy was to conserve petrol and tyres? Does he consider that the travelling of 1,500 unloaded vehicle miles is in accordance with that policy?

Mr. Noel-Baker

I have not had long notice of the Question, and I have not the information that I require to answer. This may be a case of bad operation; that is bound to happen sometimes when you are working 20,000 vehicles; it may be due to unforeseeable accidents, or there may be some other explanation; but I cannot tell my hon. and gallant Friend now.

Captain Strickland

Will the hon. Gentleman also say whether steps were taken to find out what loads were going North on that occasion?

Mr. Noel-Baker

That is one of the things about which I am inquiring.

27. Captain Strickland

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of War Transport whether he will inform the House of the circumstances which necessitated two six-ton lorries being sent by his Department from A. E. Taylor and Company, Limited, in the week ended 5th February, from London to Widnes empty, Widnes to London loaded, London to Cambridge empty, thence to Bishop's Stortford empty, on to Epping empty, Epping to Didcot loaded, Didcot to Oxford empty, thence to Slough empty, Slough to Colnbrook empty, thence to London loaded, as this involved 622 loaded vehicle miles as against 822 empty.

Mr. Noel-Baker

The two lorries to which my hon. and gallant Friend refers were sent to Widnes to help in clearing an accumulation of essential traffic. No loads were available for the outward journey. I am making inquiries about the subsequent operation of these vehicles and I will write to my hon. and gallant Friend when I have received the information for which I have asked.

Captain Strickland

Would the Minister also ascertain what steps were taken, and through what channels, to see what loads were available?

Mr. Noel-Baker

I have done that and I am satisfied that there were no loads which could not have been better sent by other transport.

28. Mr. G. Strauss

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of War Transport whether he is aware of the frequency with which lorries make return journeys empty and, in particular, that many lorries leave London for towns in the Midlands and the North with no load when there are quantities of goods urgently waiting to be transported to these towns; and will he review the present working of the road-haulage scheme.

Mr. Noel-Baker

As I explained to my hon. Friend the Member for South Croydon (Sir H. Williams) on 26th January, the traffic to be carried between two given places may often be consistently heavier in one direction that it is in the others. This is true of traffic between London and the Midlands and the North, and, generally speaking, there is an excess of carrying capacity from London to these areas. I am not aware that the road haulage of any goods has been forbidden when no other means of transport was available. I would add, however, that, as more traffic is transferred to road transport to relieve the railways, the amount of empty running between these areas will be reduced.

Mr. Strauss

In view of the frequent complaints of the empty return of lorries, when there are goods waiting for transport to the destination of the lorries, is the Minister really satisfied that the scheme is working satisfactorily?

Mr. Noel-Baker

It is not necessarily an advantage to send goods by road, if they can be better sent by rail or canal. It depends on capacity.

Mr. Levy

Is the Minister aware that the organisation of transport is getting into disrepute, and that there is unrest throughout the country in regard to transport, because of people seeing empty lorries running around all over the country?

Mr. Noel-Baker

I am aware that there appears to be great anxiety to show that it does not work well, but when I inquire, I do not find that the evidence of bad working is very good.