HC Deb 27 July 1943 vol 391 cc1506-7

Lords Amendment: In page 2, line 21, leave out "either."

The Secretary of State for Scotland (Mr. T. Johnston)

I beg to move, "That this House doth agree with the Lords in the said Amendment."

We have not now sufficient training facilities for the training of nurses. Existing facilities are, by common consent, insufficient. We are 700 trained nurses short of requirements and 600 assistant nurses short of requirements. The Amendment, which was accepted by the Government in another place, makes some little contribution to training facilities. There are seven base hospitals under the emergency scheme owned and staffed by the Government and it is desired that, as far as possible, they should be put in a position to afford training facilities in addition to those already provided by voluntary and local authority hospitals. For so long as they are there, we think it desirable that the extra facilities that they can provide, should be afforded for developing the number of nurses so badly wanted.

Mr. Kirkwood (Dumbarton Burghs)

Are you doing your best to retain them?

Mr. Johnston

Undoubtedly. I understand that it is apprehended in some quarters that these State hospitals will not be subject to General Nursing Council Regulations. It is true that the form in which the Amendment has to be moved appears to provide that these State hospitals will be in the same position as service hospitals, and therefore excluded from the control of the General Nursing Council, but on the day that we decided to accept this Amendment this letter was sent to the Registrar General of the Nursing Council on my instructions: The Secretary of State wishes me to assure the Council that, in the event of it being decided to provide training facilities at any of the Department's hospitals, he would welcome inspection of the hospitals on behalf of the Council in the usual way and would comply with the Council's requirements on a voluntary basis In other words, the regulations and provisions which are made in other hospitals for the training of nurses will be gladly accepted in our State hospitals as well. There is, therefore, no fear whatever that we are trying to add to the number of training facilities outside the control of the General Nursing Council. On the con- trary, I hope we shall have the assistance of the Council and of voluntary and local authority hospitals in one general comprehensive co-operative scheme for the training of large numbers of nurses. We have at the moment a considerable number of student nurses' applications but we have not training facilities for them. I have already had meetings with the voluntary hospital authorities and our State hospital directors and I have endeavoured to get a co-operative scheme by which nurses partially trained in our hospitals for three months move to other hospitals later on for other training, and I hope that by that means we shall augment the training facilities. I am sure that some of the misapprehensions which have been raised are quite without foundation and I trust the House will support us in every effort that we make to augment training facilities in these difficult times.

Commander Galbraith (Glasgow, Pollok)

The Secretary of State is giving an assurance that the training of nurses, no matter in which institutions they are trained, will come under the direction of the General Nursing Council and that the same standards will apply?

Mr. Johnston

Not quite. It applies to all the training facilities under the Bill, but Air Force facilities and so on do not come within it. With that proviso the hon. and gallant Gentleman is correct.

Question, "That this House doth agree with the Lords in the said Amendment," put, and agreed to.

Lords Amendment in page 2, line 23, agreed to.

Lords Amendment: In page 2, line 32, leave out "sixth day of May, nineteen hundred and forty-three "and insert "passing of this Act."

Mr. Johnston

I beg to move, "That this House doth agree with the Lords in the said Amendment."

This is a formal proposal to change the date. It gives us a little longer period in which we can bring nurses in under the facilities provided in the Bill.

Question put, and agreed to.

Remaining Lords Amendment agreed to.