HC Deb 15 April 1943 vol 388 cc1380-2
45. Lieut.-Colonel Sir Ian Fraser

asked the Prime Minister whether he will move to set up a Select Committee of this House to consider war pensions?

The Prime Minister (Mr. Churchill)

I should not be justified in placing upon this House and on my right hon. Friend the Minister of Pensions the very heavy burden which would inevitably result from the appointment of a Select Committee unless the main principles of the war pensions system were the subject of serious controversy. Such questions as have been raised in Debate or otherwise do not affect essential principles but are rather concerned with matters which fall properly within the scope of existing machinery. I understand that my right hon. Friend has already brought a number of these questions before his Central Advisory Committee, on which the various parties in this House are well represented, and that others are being put down for discussion at future meetings. This procedure is likely to be much more expeditious than the deliberations of a Select Committee.

Sir I. Fraser

If we are to use this rather inadequate machinery, may I ask my right hon. Friend whether he will try to improve it and make it more sensitive to the opinion of this House and public opinion? Is he aware, for example, that the Minister of Pensions himself takes the chair at this Committee and orders its agenda, and that among its members are his Parliamentary Private Secretary, the Chief Officer of the Ministry, his assistant and another officer? Further, is he aware that the Committee does not report to anyone but the Minister, so that it is a little hard to feel that it is a sensitive Committee?

The Prime Minister

My right hon. Friend will no doubt be desirous of making sure that the Committee is properly representative, but it is not the intention of the Government to transfer any executive power in this matter from the Government.

Mr. Bellenger

Has the Prime Minister considered the recent Debate that took place on pensions matters, when hardly any hon. Member of this House had anything but criticism for the operation of the Royal Warrant at the present moment? In view of those circumstances, will he do something in the direction suggested by my hon. and gallant Friend the Member for Lonsdale (Sir I. Fraser)?

The Prime Minister

During the whole of my service in this House I have never known any occasion when a Debate on pensions has not given universal dissatisfaction.

Mr. Kirby

Is the Prime Minister aware that under existing conditions the Minister of Pensions refuses to accept responsibility for the deaths of men killed on war service? Does he not think that something ought to be done?

The Prime Minister

That Question should be put on the Order Paper.

Earl Winterton

Did I understand my right hon. Friend to say that if there is an expression of opinion in this House, as strong as was expressed on a previous occasion, of dissatisfaction with the administration of the Ministry of Pensions, he will, in accordance with the usual practice, consider what action he will take?

The Prime Minister

I think Parliament is possessed of all the necessary powers for controlling and influencing the Executive.