HC Deb 12 July 1937 vol 326 cc851-4
55. Colonel Nathan

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he will, for the convenience of hon. Members, place in the Tea Room as early as possible a relief map of Palestine and Transjordan showing thereon the suggested mandated areas, Jewish state, Arab state, and Aqaba enclave?

The Secretary of State for the Colonies (Mr. Ormsby-Gore)

I will certainly consider the hon. and gallant Member's suggestion for the provision of a relief map, but I fear that it would not be practicable to show the areas in question with sufficient accuracy on such a map until it has been possible to arrive at a much more exact definition of the boundaries than is contained in the Report of the Royal Commission.

Colonel Nathan

Will not the right hon. Gentleman represent on the suggested relief map the boundaries as disclosed in the map annexed to the Report upon which the recommendations of the Royal Commission are founded?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

The map drawn in the Report is a sketch, and I am quite sure misunderstanding would arise on both sides if you had a large scale map on a matter upon which they say advisedly that a boundary commission should be set up.

Colonel Wedgwood

When are we going to get the boundary commission?

56. Mr. De Chair

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether it is the intention of His Majesty's Government to give effect to the recommendations of the Royal Commission on Palestine in such a way that the proposed independent Arab and Jewish states shall cease to be parts of the British Empire?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

Palestine has never been a part of the British Empire. As regards the intentions of His Majesty's Government, I must refer my hon. Friend to the Government's published Statement of Policy, to which I am unable to add.

Mr. De Chair

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that Article 1 of the Mandate confers upon us full powers of administration and legislation, and that therefore the mandated territory for poliical and strategical purposes, is part of the Empire?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

That is certainly not so. If my hon. Friend will read the other articles of the Mandate and the Preamble, and Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, he will see that he is wrong.

Commander Locker-Lampson

May I ask my right hon. Friend whether it is not a great mistake that His Majesty's Government should take their marching orders from Signor Mussolini in this respect?

57. Colonel Nathan

asked the Secretary of State for the Colonies the reasons why the memoranda and minutes of public evidence expressly stated by the Royal Commission on Palestine, at page xii of their report, as having been prepared to accompany the report, were not issued with the report; when they will be issued; whether they will be placed before the Permanent Mandates Commission by His Majesty's Government at the same time as the report; and whether the Permanent Mandates Commission will have before it the minutes of the evidence of the 53 witnesses stated at page x of the report to have been heard in private?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

I do not think that the passage in the report of the Royal Commission to which the hon. and gallant Member refers necessarily means that the memoranda and minutes of public evidence would be published simultaneously with the report. Owing to the short time available this was in any case quite impracticable. As regards the second part of the question, I would refer the hon. Member to the reply which I gave to him on 8th July. The answers to the third and fourth parts of the question are in the negative.

Colonel Nathan

Is it to be assumed that the Permanent Mandates Commission is to be invited by His Majesty's Government to make a decision upon a matter of such importance and difficulty without having an opportunity of having before it the evidence upon which His Majesty's Government have based their Statement of Policy, and upon which the recommendations of the Royal Commission were made?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

The hon. and gallant Gentleman is clearly at fault. His Majesty's Government have not, and will not see, the confidential evidence which was given solely to the Royal Commission in confidence, and which is always kept under seal. It will not be given to me, and it cannot be given to the Permanent Mandates Commission. The Permanent Mandates Commission is not asked for a decision, but always to advise the Council of the League, which alone has the power to take a decision.

Colonel Nathan

Will the Permanent Mandates Commission have before it the evidence which the Royal Commission expressly states that it has prepared, namely, the public evidence and the memorandum, and will it have it when it meets at the end of July at the same time as it has the recommendations of His Majesty's Government?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

No, nobody will have it. It will not be printed by then. The report is so full and so exhaustive and contains all the material facts, that I am quite sure it would be superfluous.

An Hon. Member

Will it be available to this House?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

Certainly, Sir, as soon as it is printed.

Mr. Stephen

Can the right hon. Gentleman give any idea when the minutes of evidence will be published?

Mr. Ormsby-Gore

They are printing them as fast as they can. It is very voluminous, an enormous mass of material, and I think it will be ready in about a month's time.