§ 10.54 p.m.
Mr. ANDERSONI do not wish to detain the House long, but the matter I wish to raise is one, I think, of more than ordinary importance. Some time ago I received a complaint from a number of young men in my constituency who had been to a training camp in Lincolnshire—it would not be fair to give the name—and they left the camp, rightly or wrongly, because they felt that the conditions operating at that time were most unsatisfactory. I decided that I would visit the camp unexpectedly so that I might find out what the conditions were. I found that the camp was made up of a number of Army huts, and that these men were having to sleep in the huts. The beds were only three or four inches from the floor, and were composed of a mattress and a number of coloured blankets. A number of the mattresses were in very bad condition, and a number of the mattress covers had not been washed for some considerable time. The blankets were coloured. I understand that drafts of men are sent into the camp from time to time, and that the same blankets are used without being fumigated or washed. That is a very serious matter, especially when you may be dealing with all types of 523 men coming into the camp from all sorts of different homes, because the blankets are used next to the person of the occupants of the beds. They have no sheet, as we understand it. I could not get any definite proof that the blankets had been fumigated or washed, and something should be done to make perfectly sure that cleanliness is provided for these men.
Where the men had to sleep there were just the ordinary windows that opened at the top, and some of the men actually had to sleep under those windows. A few of the men slept only a yard or two away from the lavatory accommodation. The fires were of a type where there were back draughts from time to time when the windows were open. Wood was used as well as coal, and there were general complaints from the men as to the smoky condition of the fireplaces. There was undoubtedly truth in some of the complaints that the men made. The next thing I noticed, arising out of complaints from the men, was the condition of the pillows, which were in a disgraceful state in some of the huts, to say the least of it. They appeared not to have been washed for a fortnight or three weeks. Some of the pillows were rather clean, others were very dirty. When I asked when the pillows had last been washed, I received the reply that they were washed every week, but I saw with my own eyes that they could not have been washed in every week. In a camp of this description, set up by the Ministry of Labour, there should be some record in the event of complaints being made, so that the responsibility can be placed upon the proper shoulders. I think this point should receive attention from the Minister. I have already spoken to the Parliamentary Secretary about the points which I have mentioned this evening.
Next I went into what they called the cookhouse, and the first thing I noticed was the noise of an army of crickets. I spoke about it, and I was told, "You ought to come here at night." There were two or three men there who, in my view, were not experienced men for a cookhouse and that brings me to the point that the men from my own constituency told me very definitely, that, on one occasion, there were no less than—
§ It being Eleven of the Clock, the Motion for the Adjournment lapsed, without Question put.
§ Question again proposed, "That this House do now adjourn."—[Sir A. Lambert Ward.]
Mr. ANDERSONOn one Sunday evening there were no fewer than 14 plates returned, because the men had been given a kind of food that they could not possibly eat. I cannot say how far that is true, nor can the chief of the camp, and I mention that fact because I feel that if complaints are made, the chief of the camp ought to know of them and there ought to be some record kept. There ought to be some kind of a log book, and it should be the responsibility of the men to see that complaints that are made are put in the log book. Those men said that the food from time to time had not been what they could easily consume; at least, it was not like the food they had been receiving at their own homes. In addition to that, these men complained very strongly over the way in which they were treated with regard to weather conditions. I should explain that a number of the men have been accustomed to working down a mine with a very high temperature. These men were put into a motor lorry and driven, I understand, four, five, and six miles, to what is termed a gravel pit, at a time when the weather was very cold indeed. They had no protection except just a cape, and I feel that some consideration should be given to men who have been accustomed to working under very hot conditions, especially when they are taken into the open air in very cold weather. It is a serious matter.
What I saw, I can safely say, warrants me in asking that the Minister should give consideration to the question of appointing some kind of welfare officer for these camps, whose responsibility it should be to go round to the camps to see whether they are being properly conducted or not. This officer should have the opportunity of seeing any log books that are kept, what kinds of complaints are made, and how far they are being remedied. With regard to the hut floors, some of them, in my view, had not been washed for at least a month. Undoubtedly, there were one or two clean floors, but there was a goodly number that had never been 525 washed at all. In addition, the men say that they were called upon to wash the floors they had to move the beds from one end of the hut to the other and then back again as the washing proceeded, and that caused serious dampness. I found that some of the mattresses were rather damp, arising, I think, from the method adopted in washing the floors. Undoubtedly there are good grounds for saying that some kind of welfare officer should be appointed to visit these camps at his own discretion and to be directly responsible to the Minister, and to no other officer, so that if the Minister received any complaints, he might be in a position to send that welfare officer to investigate them on the spot, without any other officer knowing. The conditions that I saw in this camp, if they are repeated elsewhere, certainly warrant something tangible being done in the direction which I have indicated.
§ 11.5 p.m.
§ Lieut.-Colonel MUIRHEADThe hon. Member has certainly waited as long as the other hon. Members who have preceded him, and he has had to wait a further period. I am very glad that he has had the opportunity of ventilating his views on this subject, as a result of his personal investigations. He has kindly discussed these matters very fully with me in private, which has enabled me to look into the many points he has raised and to answer his questions much better than I could otherwise have done. It is fair to say that the hon. Member is raising these points simply with a desire to improve the efficiency of the camps and not with a desire to make political capital. Therefore, he has considerately withheld the name of the particular camp to which he refers. In all these cases where someone, after investigation, makes certain statements, it is difficult, unless one has seen the actual centre, either to confirm or refute the allegations.
The hon. Member has referred to the mattresses. It is a rule in connection with these centres that every man on joining is supplied with a mattress, which has been treated in a disinfector, and a mattress case, which has been laundered. The same in regard to blankets. Each man on arrival has an issue of blankets, which have been disinfected. These blankets are similarly dealt with in & 526 disinfector one or twice in the course of the man's stay. With regard to latrines, where there is no water system, and in this case there is none, the latrine and bucket system is adopted, the latrines being erected under the supervision and in accordance with the specifications of His Majesty's Office of Works. The buckets are emptied and cleaned daily, and disinfected.
In regard to the point raised by the hon. Member about having a log book in which records are made, that is a recommendation which he brought to my notice, and I think there is a good deal in it. As regards the crickets, all I can say is that they were not authorised. With regard to the question of miners being driven in lorries, it is true that whether you have worked in a mine or not you do not want to be driven very far in a lorry on a cold day. I have had no complaints about miners or other people being driven in lorries on cold days under hard conditions. With respect to the welfare officer, there is a welfare officer specially allocated to each centre, whose specific task, as his title indicates, is to look after the recreations and the welfare of the men generally at the centre. There is one per centre. There are in addition visits by the ordinary training inspectorate of the Ministry. They go round inspecting, not only instructional centres, but the other various activities of the Ministry throughout the country. These training branch inspectors make comparatively frequent visits to these instructional centres, and in the case of this centre, at the time when the hon. Member first raised the case, there had been six visits by officers of the training branch inspectorate within the last six months, which, for purposes of general supervision, I think is not inadequate.
That is my answer to the various points which the hon. Member has raised, but I should like, before I sit down, to pay a tribute to the way in which the hon. Member has treated this case. We at the Ministry are only too glad for hon. Members and others to pay visits to the instructional centres, and hon. Members may rest assured that there is nothing there that we want to hide. We are only too pleased if hon. Members who take an interest in this work will pay their visits, and we are particularly pleased when hon. Members bring forward 527 constructive suggestions, as the hon. Member has done to-night—and not merely bring forward constructive suggestions, but get constructive improvements effected. To make a hole in a box may not seem to be a very constructive thing to do, but in point of fact that is what the hon. Member has effected. He has caused a large number of holes to be made in a large number of boxes, and when I tell the House that the boxes are the men's lockers in which their clothes are kept, and that the holes are for ventilation purposes and did not exist before the hon. Member went to the centre, but do exist now—and we have passed the idea round to other instructional centres in the country—it will be seen that there are many constructive suggestions, perhaps simple in nature but very important in effect and very helpful, which those who, like the hon. Member, have had long experience of this sort of thing can make—[An HON. MEMBER: "To keep the crickets out!"] As I have already said, the crickets were not authorised, and I do not propose to deal with them. I hope that these few remarks of mine have indicated the policy of the Ministry with regard to instructional centres, and the general instructions for the arrangements which are carried out.