HC Deb 27 February 1936 vol 309 cc644-8
58. Mr. A. HENDERSON

asked the Minister of Health the number of widows who were refused pensions under the Widows', Orphans', and Old Age Contributory Pensions Acts during the years 1932 to 1935, inclusive, by reason of their husbands permitting continuity of insurance to be broken during periods of unemployment through failure to have their cards franked at the employment exchanges?

Sir K. WOOD

I am not aware that claims for pension have been refused for the reason given by the hon. Member. Failure to secure franks at the employment exchange does not necessarily involve loss of pension, because alternative evidence can be submitted in proof of unemployment.

Mr. HENDERSON

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that, in a number of eases which I have brought to the notice of his Department, the unfortunate widow has been deprived of pension on the ground that the husband, during the two-years standard period of insurance, has failed to have the necessary amount of franks put on his card, and, as a result, there has been a break in the continuity of his insurance?

Sir K. WOOD

I should like it to be understood that all alternative evidence that is available will be taken into account.

Mr. HENDERSON

Could the right hon. Gentleman make that clear to the local authorities, in view of the fact that, under the regulations issued by the Ministry of Labour in reference to inconsiderable employment, which were discussed here last night, the number of these cases is likely to increase?

Sir K. WOOD

I do not think that that is so, and in any case the officials are well acquainted with the matter.

59. Mr. A. HENDERSON

asked the Minister of Health whether he proposes to introduce legislation to allow small shopkeepers to become voluntary contributors under the National Health Insurance Acts?

Sir K. WOOD

I would refer the hon. Member to the statement regarding extension of insurance which I made in this House on 10th December last, and of which I am sending him a copy.

Mr. T. SMITH

Can the right hon. Gentleman give the House an assurance that, when the new legislation is introduced, it will not he limited to small shopkeepers?

Sir K. WOOD

I could not give that assurance.

60. Mr. HENDERSON

asked the Minister of Health the total number of widows who claimed pensions under the Widows', Orphans', and Old Age Con-tributary Pensions Acts during the years 1932 to 1935, inclusive; the number granted and the number refused owing to stamp disqualifications; and whether he will consider introducing legislation to mitigate the hardship caused by such refusals?

Sir K. WOOD

The answer to the earlier parts of the hon. Member's question contains a number of figures, and I will, with permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT. The answer to the last part is in the negative. In a contributory scheme certain minimum conditions must be complied with, and the finances of the scheme will not permit any further relaxation of the conditions laid down in the Contributory Pensions Acts.

Mr. HENDERSON

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that the scheme is by no means effective at the present time; and, in the event of his being satisfied that that is so, will he consider introducing legislation?

Sir K. WOOD

It is a question of finance.

Following are the figures:

Claims to Widows Pensions in England and Wales.
1932. 1933. 1934. 1935.
Claims received. 86,420 90,600 83,570 78,960
Pensions awarded. 80,170 77,890 70,790 67,960
Claims rejected. 13,170 12,050 11,880 11,450

Details of the causes of rejection are not available, but it may be taken that the number which failed on contribution tests did not reach 10 per cent. of the total rejections.

67. Mr. SMEDLEY CROOKE

asked the Minister of Health, with regard to the case of a voluntary contributor under the National Health and Old Age Pensions Acts who removes to the Irish Free State, what arrangements are made to enable such a person to continue paying contributions and to draw the pension there on reaching the age of 65 or, alternatively, to obtain a refund of the amounts voluntarily paid in?

Sir K. WOOD

A voluntary contributor under the health and pensions insurance scheme who removes to the Irish Free State may in that country continue his insurance for pensions only, with an appropriately reduced contribution, and receive payment of the pension when it falls due. I am sending my hon. Friend a leaflet giving details of the arrangements. There is no provision for the refund of contributions properly paid.

69. Mr. SUTCLIFFE

asked the Minister of Health whether, in view of the uncertainty which exists among many insured persons as to the rights of becoming voluntary contributors in specific circumstances, he will instruct approved societies to exercise greater care in warning their members as to their rights and privileges under the Widows', Orphans' and Old Age Contributory Pensions Acts?

Sir K. WOOD

Instructions on the subject to which my hon. Friend refers have already been given to all approved societies. I will consider whether any further steps can be taken to secure that full and correct information is given.

74. Mr. HOLLINS

asked the Minister of Health whether he is contemplating legislation to extend the National Health Insurance Act so as to include small traders and persons working on their own account; and, if so, whether he will take into consideration the reduction of the pensionable age at which spinsters may be entitled to the pension from 65 to 55 years?

Sir K. WOOD

As regards the first part of the question, I would refer the hon. Member to the statement regarding extension of insurance which I made in this House on 10th December last, and of which I am sending him a copy. As regards the second part, I would refer to the reply given by my hon. Friend the Financial Secretary to the Treasury to a similar question asked by the hon. Member for Walthamstow on 20th February.

Miss RATHBONE

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the system of health insurance as affecting elderly women is a little better than a fraud, and even more so unemployment insurance, and will he instigate an inquiry into both forms of insurance as they affect women contributors, who are paying more than double what the benefits are worth?

Sir K. WOOD

I deprecate this violent language.

Mr. BELLENGER

Is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that what the hon. Lady says is true?

76. Mr. R. C. MORRISON

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he will consider amending the present scheme of widows' pensions to include certain groups of widows in poor circumstances at present excluded from the scheme?

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER (Mr. Chamberlain)

I assume that the hon. Member has in mind extension of the classes eligible for noncontributory widows' pensions. If so, I regret that this is not practicable.