HC Deb 01 March 1935 vol 298 cc1543-4

Motion made, and Question proposed,

"That the Clause stand part of the Bill."

3.49 p.m.

Mr. LAWSON

We recognise that this is a very important Bill, and in the ordinary course we would have liked to have had some time for dealing with it. My hon. Friend the Member for Lime-house (Mr. Attlee) spoke at some length on the Second Reading. The first Clause contains practically the heart of the Bill. I want to say briefly now what my hon. Friend said on the Second Reading, that we support the Bill and wish the Postmaster-General well in this great Socialist effort of his. The Bill is for the purpose of the development of the postal, telegraph and telephone systems and it gives power to raise something like £34,000,000. As I say, we wish the Postmaster-General well in this effort, which, I am sure will add to his public stature and his general credit. At the same time I feel sure that, whatever it adds to his public stature, it will be an embarrassing factor to him as far as his own political views are concerned.

The POSTMASTER-GENERAL (Sir Kingsley Wood)

I would only remark in reply to the hon. Gentleman that if he will refer to his hon. 'Friend the Member for Limehouse (Mr. Attlee) I think his hon. Friend will tell him that the Post Office is an example of State capitalism and nothing else.

3.51 p.m.

Mr. LANSBURY

We certainly do not regard it in that way. We regard the development of the Post Office as a part of the evolution of things, by which we shall travel from competitive commer cialism to State Socialism and finally to proper Socialism. I am sorry that the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Carnarvon Boroughs (Mr. Lloyd George) is not here to congratulate the right hon. Gentleman the Postmaster-General but I want to congratulate all who are interested in public works on the fact that here we are providing an example of the means whereby money can be raised for such purposes. It is often said to us, "Where are you going to get the money?" Here is a case in which a sum of £34,000,000 is going to come along without any difficulty or trouble. The industry in which it is going to be invested will carry the charges and pay it off exactly as if it were a big private monopolist company. Therefore, do not let us have any more nonsense in the future about not being able to find the money. You can find it when you have the will to find it and are determined that it shall be found. I join with my bon. Friend in hearty congratulations to the Minister, and I hope that as he carries out his private duties as minister of propaganda for the Tory party, he will explain to his supporters just as he has explained to us that a State business can be carried on without anybody outside making any money out of it.

Sir WILLIAM DAVISON

Does the right hon. Gentleman not recognise that the reason for the recent success of the Post Office is the fact that it has been run in the same way as a private business and not as a Government monopoly?

Clause 2 (Short title) ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Bill reported, without Amendment; to be read the Third time upon Monday next.