HC Deb 13 November 1934 vol 293 cc1746-8
18. Major MILNER

asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office whether he is aware that none of the members of the Barnes Committee, appointed in 1924 to consider the grievances of ex-service ranker officers, had any personal or specialised knowledge of Army regulations or practices; whether they had any independent advice on such regulations or practices; and whether he will inquire further into the case of these officers with a view to remedying their present disadvantages?

The FINANCIAL SECRETARY to the WAR OFFICE (Mr. Douglas Hacking)

The object of setting up the Barnes Committee was to secure that the grievances of these officers were considered by an entirely impartial body of persons of standing and wide general experience. The claims of the officers were represented by Captain F. D. Bone and in addition many officers represented their own cases. The Committee arrived at their conclusions after hearing all the evidence and their findings were accepted not only by the Government of the day and by successive Governments, but also by the House itself after Debate. I can see no ground for re-opening the question.

Major MILNER

Will the hon. Gentleman answer the question? Had any members of the Barnes Committee any personal or specialised knowledge of Army practices or regulations, and had they any independent advice on such practices or regulations? He has carefully avoided answering those questions.

Mr. HACKING

No, I have not. I have said that this body was entirely impartial and had not any expert knowledge.

Major MILNER

Had it any independent advice on such Army regulations or practices?

Mr. HACKING

It had the advice of the persons who appeared before it, the same as any other committee. Mr. Paterson represented the War Office.

Major MILNER

Was not Mr. Paterson the only individual advising that committee on the Army regulations and practices?

Mr. HACKING

As far as I know, he was the only representative from the War Office.

Mr. WILMOT

Am I to understand from the reply that the Government have definitely decided to do nothing with regard to these ex-ranker officers?

Mr. HACKING

I would go further than that—

Mr. SPEAKER

Sir Alfred Knox.

19. Major-General Sir ALFRED KNOX

asked the Financial Secretary to the War Office what would be the approximate annual cost of satisfying the demands of ex-ranker officers?

Mr. HACKING

In 1923 the cost of this claim and the consequential claims which it would be difficult to resist was estimated at a diminishing annual charge of £675,000, without including widows' pensions. Data for a revised estimate are not available, and I do not think that the work involved in obtaining them would be justifiable having regard to the fact that the claims of these officers were decided on their merits and without reference to the cost involved.

Sir A. KNOX

Is it not a fact that the number of claimants for this pension is constantly diminishing, the average age being 62, and would not the amount now involved be so much less, something like £100,000?

Mr. HACKING

I do not know what the amount involved now would be. It would certainly be less than the figure I have given, but it would still be a very considerable sum of money.

Sir A. KNOX

Would it not be common justice for the Government to do this thing in order to satisfy the claims of a most deserving class?

Mr. HACKING

That is really not the point. These men have no legal claim at all, and if we reopened their claims we should have to reopen thousands of claims from others who have just as much right to demand charity from the State. The Government do not think that is a desirable thing.

Mr. JANNER

In view of the fact that there is a considerable amount of feeling in the matter and that the amount is so small, does not the right hon. Gentleman consider it possible to reopen this case?

Mr. HACKING

The hon. Member says that the amount involved is small. I said the other day, in answer to a question, that the total amount involved was no less than £10,000,000, which is a very considerable sum.

Major MILNER

Arising out of the original question—

Mr. SPEAKER

Hon. Members must not argue this question.

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