HC Deb 30 January 1930 vol 234 cc1217-9

Considered in Committee under Standing Order No. 71A.

[Mr. ROBERT YOUNG in the Chair.]

Motion made, and Question proposed, That, for the purpose of any Act of the present Session (hereinafter referred to as "the said Act") to provide for regulating and facilitating the production, supply, and sale of coal by owners of coal mines, for the temporary amendment of Section three of the Coal Mines Regulation Act, 1908, for the constitution and functions of a Coal Mines National Industrial Board, and for purposes connected with the matters aforesaid, it is expedient to authorise the payment, out of moneys provided by Parliament:—

  1. (i) of any expenses incurred by the Board of Trade in paying—
    1. (a) such remuneration (if any) to the chairmen of the committees of investigation constituted by the said Act, such travelling and subsistence allowances to the chairmen and members of those committees, such remuneration to the secretaries to those committees and such remuneration to accountants, officers, and servants employed by those committees, and such other expenses of those committees, as the Board of Trade may, with the approval of the Treasury, determine;
    2. (b) such remuneration (if any) to the chairman of the Coal Mines National Industrial Board to be constituted under the said Act, such travelling and subsistence allowances to the chairman and members of that Board, such remuneration to the secretary of that Board, and such other expenses of that Board as the Board of Trade may, with the approval of the Treasury, determine;
    3. (c) such remuneration to the members of the Coal Mines Reorganisation Commission constituted by the said Act, and to the secretary, officers, and servants of that Commission, and such other expenses of that Commission as the Board of Trade may, with the approval of the Treasury, determine;
    4. (d) such remuneration as the Board of Trade may, with the approval of the Treasury, determine to such technical and professional agents as may he employed by the said Commission for the discharge of the functions of the Commission under the said Act, so, however, that a sum equal to the amount of any expenses incurred by the employment of such agents as aforesaid for the purpose of promoting or assisting the amalgamation of any undertakings consisting of or comprising coal mines shall, in the event of the undertakings being amalgamated, be repaid to the Board of Trade by the owners of the amalgamated undertaking; and
    1218
  2. (ii) of such other expenses as may be required to be defrayed for the purposes of the said Act."—(King's Recommendation signified.)—[Mr. William Graham.]

Mr. BATEY

On a point of Order. I want to ask your Ruling, Mr. Young, with regard to an important sentence in this Money Resolution. The Resolution contains these words: for the temporary amendment of Section three of the Coal Mines Regulation Act, 1908. The 1908 Act was the original Act which provided for eight hours underground and half an hour winding-time, or eight and a-half hours. I submit that this has nothing whatever to do with money. The Government are taking power here to amend Section 3 of that Act. Section 3 gave to an owner, agent or manager power on 60 days in one year to increase the time by one hour, making eight and a-half hours into nine and a-half hours. I submit that the object of the Government can be only to increase the 60 days or to increase the hours, and that this sentence ought not to be in the Money Resolution, as it has nothing whatever to do with money. The Government make no provision either in the Bill or in the Amendments on the Paper for an increase in miners' hours, and I, therefore, ask your Ruling as to whether this sentence ought to be in this Resolution.

The CHAIRMAN

I have no power to alter or delete words in the Resolution. A Money Resolution is for specific purpose or purposes, and the Government are entitled to make the Resolution fully cover the objects of the Bill.

The PRESIDENT of the BOARD of TRADE (Mr. William Graham)

This Resolution carries out the undertaking which I gave to the House two days ago, and, I understand, will now be passed without discussion.

Sir PHILIP CUNLIFFE-LISTER

I am very much obliged to the right hon. Gentleman for having tabled afresh Resolution in this form. I think that the words of paragraph (ii)— of such other expenses as may be required to be defrayed for the purposes of the said Act, are as wide as any Financial Resolution can possibly be, and we shall now be in order in discussing any Amendment that may be moved within the scope and Title of the Bill. I am very much obliged to the right hon. Gentleman for the action he has taken, and I think the fact that he has tabled a Resolution in this form shows how important it was that we drew attention to the matter.

Mr. LLOYD GEORGE

I think that the right hon. Gentleman has very fairly and honourably carried out his undertaking.

Mr. TINKER

Will the President of the Board of Trade clear up the point which was raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Spennymoor (Mr. Batey)? There may be nothing in it, but if our fears are well founded, then I am with him in fighting this particular point in the Money Resolution.

Mr. W. GRAHAM

The short reply is that the preliminary part of this Resolution is merely descriptive of the Title of the Bill.

Question put, and agreed to.

Resolution to be reported upon Monday next.