HC Deb 11 February 1930 vol 235 cc199-200
15. Mr. BUCHANAN

asked the Secretary of State for Scotland if he is aware that at the hearing of appeals in cases of widows' and old age pension claims before the arbiter in Glasgow the Scottish Board of Health is represented by a solicitor skilled in this class of case; that he always opposes the claim to a pension of the applicant; and, as in many cases they are poor and old people and many unable to state their case with the same skill as the solicitor representing the Board of Health, if he will take steps to see that legal aid is given in full to every applicant for a pension?

Mr. JOHNSTON

The answer to the first part of the question is in the affirmative. The solicitor attends to lay before the referee the grounds on which the decision of the Department of Health for Scotland was based.

Although I have no reason to doubt that under the existing procedure claimants for pensions under the Widows', Orphans' and Old Age Contributory Pensions Acts who appeal against the decision of the Department are afforded full opportunity of stating their case to the referees, I appreciate that claimants who are unable to engage the services of a lawyer or have not the assistance of a trade union official are at a disadvantage, but the suggestion with which my hon. Friend's question concludes raises very wide issues which I am considering.

Mr. BUCHANAN

In view of the fact that the hon. Gentleman has himself advocated a public defender for the criminal section of the community, why cannot we have an advocate for this section of the community when they have not done anything wrong but are merely asking for a pension? Is he aware that this solicitor takes up a most aggressive attitude against the old people who are desirous of receiving justice?

Mr. JOHNSTON

I can only repeat that the question of changes involved are at present under consideration. There is sympathy with the hon. Gentleman's point in the Department.

Mr. BUCHANAN

May I ask the hon. Gentleman at least to ask the solicitor to the Scottish Board of Health to be fair to applicants in the meantime?

Mr. STEPHEN

Will the hon. Gentleman consider withdrawing the solicitor who is appearing at present and letting the cases come before the tribunal without any solicitor simply on the facts sent down by the Department?

Mr. JOHNSTON

That may involve similar changes in regard to administration, and it is not possible for me to give an answer to that point now.