§ 9. Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYasked the President of the Board of Trade whether any progress has been 1557 made with the proposed pension and superannuation Scheme for the masters and officers of the Royal Mercantile Marine; what is the present state of the negotiations with the shipping companies and other interested bodies; and how many private pension and superannuation schemes for their officers have been established by British shipping companies?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERRetired masters and officers of the Mercantile Marine may, in common with other seafarers, apply for pensions from the Seamen's Pension Fund set up under the National Insurance Acts, and they are also eligible for Old Age Pensions; but as the hon. and gallant Member was informed on 6th May, 1924, and 7th August, 1924, it is impossible for the State to contribute to a special pension scheme for any one industry unless it is prepared to contribute to similar schemes for all other industries. There are no negotiations on the subject in progress with shipping companies or other interested bodies. I regret I am not in a position to state how many private pension and superannuation schemes for officers are in existence.
§ Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that this scheme could be put into force if a few recalcitrant private companies could be brought into line with the majority of the shipowners, and that that could be done without any Government subsidy whatever?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERNo, I am not aware of that. The answer that I have given to the hon. and gallant Gentleman, which I think is strictly accurate and fair, is the same answer as he received from my predecessor when his own party was in office.
§ Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that nearly five years have passed since that answer was given? Why does he always fall back for security on his predecessors?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERI do not always do so; I do so only when they were right.
§ Sir BASIL PETOWill my right hon. Friend make it quits clear that his 1558 answer has no reference to pension schemes for officers and men serving in the Royal Fleet Auxiliaries?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERI do not think that that question arises. Any question dealing with conditions of service in the Royal Navy is entirely governed by Admiralty Regulations.
§ Sir ROBERT THOMASIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that there is complete understanding on this matter between the shipowners and the Sailors' and Firemen's Union?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERI could not give precise figures as to the number of schemes in operation, but I believe that there is a very considerable number of arrangements at present in operation in a large number of shipping companies.
§ Sir R. THOMASIs the right hon. Gentleman not aware that in all matters concerning the Mercantile Marine, where the welfare of. sailors and firemen is concerned, there is the closest possible understanding and co-operation between the trade union and the shipowners?
§ Sir P. CUNLIFFE-LISTERYes.
§ Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHYThe officers whom I have mentioned are not members of the Sailors' and Firemen's Union.
§ Mr. STEPHENIn the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Sailors and. Firemen's Union do exactly what the bosses tell them?
§ Sir R. THOMASNO, They do not.