HC Deb 30 November 1926 vol 200 cc1122-7

With regard to the Amendment standing in the name of the hon. Member for Bradford East (Mr. Fealty) I understand from Mr. Speaker that part of the matter involved has already been discussed, and, therefore, there can be no long debate upon it.


I beg to move, in page 14, line 27, to leave out the words (including those relating to the Small Holdings Commissioners). This Amendment raises a very vital issue. Up to the time when this Bill appeared, the question of the provision of small holdings have been regarded from two points of view, first from the national point of view and, second, from the local point of view. Without this Amendment the Schedule would do away with the Small Holdings Commissioners, which would mean taking away a measure of support from a man who wants a small holding when no attempt to provide one is made by the local authority. When the Act of 1908 was drawn up it was realised that it would not be always possible to obtain land for small holdings, even though the authority were desirous of meeting the demand, because it would not always be possible to obtain the land by Voluntary means, and it was then thought wise that the Ministry should have representatives in particular areas to assist county authorities faced with this difficulty in obtaining land. Between 1908 and 1914 a very large number of compulsory orders were obtained, but, at the same time, a large number of compulsory orders were avoided, becauses in cases where local authorities had failed to obtain land by Voluntary arrangements the Commissioners came in, and as they had behind them the authority and the pressure of a Government Department they were able more speedily and more amicably to obtain land.

If we study the figures showing how many acres have been provided since the 1908 Act and the Land Settlement (Facilities) Act, 1919, and study also the figures giving the number of smallholders, it will be found that they vary considerably among the authorities charged with administering the Act. Some county authorities are absolutely behind the times, whereas other authorities have made very considerable progress, and if the backward ones had done anything

like as much as the others we should have had a very much larger number of smallholders, cultivating a good many more acres, with a much greater supply of food from the land. It is this urge of the Commissioners that it is the object of my Amendment to secure.


I beg to second the Amendment.


As you pointed out in calling this Amendment, Mr. Deputy-Speaker, it really covers substantially the same point as the first New Clause which was rejected this afternoon. It is one of a series of Amendments to give the Small Holdings Commissioners the powers which they exercised under the Act of 1908. We wish to work in partnership with the local authorities, and we believe that the financial inducements which we offer in this Bill to help them to provide small holdings will be adequate to secure their ready co-operation in the work. We have had experience of how much can be done by the method of financial persuasion. There have never been any Commissioners to drive the local authorities in connection with agricultural education, and yet, by means of a carefully administered system of grants, astonishing progress in agricultural education has been made in the last 20 years, at considerable expense to the local authorities. The attitude of the county councils towards small holdings has changed very much since 1908. All have now small holdings estates, and all have zealous and experienced staffs, and, Personally, I have no doubt we shall get better results from their willing co-operation than by reinstating this obsolete system of Small Holdings Commissioners and attempting to force the authorities to provide small holdings.

Question put, "That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Bill."

The House divided: Ayes, 172; Noes, 104.

Division No. 515.] AYES. [9.29 p.m.
Acland-Troyte, Lieut.-Colonel Balfour, George (Hampstead) Birchall, Major J. Dearman
Agg-Gardner, Rt. Hon. Sir James T. Balniel, Lord Blundell, F. N.
Ainsworth, Major Charles Barclay-Harvey, C. M. Boothby, R. J. G.
Albery, Irving James Harnett, Major Sir Richard Bourne. Captain Robert Croft
Alexander, E. E. (Leyton) Beamish, Rear-Admiral T. P. H. Bowyer, Captain G. E. W.
Applin, Colonel R. V. K. Bellairs, Commander Carlyon W. Braithwaite, A. N.
Astbury, Lieut.-Commander F. W. Bennett, A. J. Brass, Captain W.
Atholl, Duchess of Betterton, Henry B. Briscoe, Richard George
Brittain, Sir Harry Headlam, Lieut.-Colonel C. M. Perkins, Colonel E. K.
Brocklebank, C. E. R. Henderson,Capt. R. R. (Oxf'd, Henley) Perring, Sir William George
Brown, Brig.-Gen.H.C.(Berks, Newb'y) Henderson, Lieut.-Col. V. L. (Bootle) Peto, G. (Somerset, Frome)
Burton, Colonel H. W. Heneage, Lieut.-Colonel Arthur P. Pownall, Lieut.-Colonel Sir Assheton
Butler, Sir Geoffrey Hennessy, Major J. R. G. Preston, William
Cadogan, Major Hon. Edward Herbert, Dennis (Hertford, Watford) Price, Major C. W. M.
Cassels, J. D. Hills, Major John Walter Raine, W.
Chamberlain, Rt. Hon. N. (Ladywood) Hilton, Cecil Rhys, Hon. C. A. U.
Christie, J. A. Holbrook, Sir Arthur Richard Rice, Sir Frederick
Churchman, Sir Arthur C. Hopkinson, Sir A. (Eng. Universities) Richardson, Sir P. W. (Sur'y, Ch'ts'y)
Clayton, G. C. Hopkinson, A. (Lancaster, Mossley) Ruggles-Brise, Major E. A.
Cochrane, Commander Hon. A. D. Hudson, Capt. A. U. M. (Hackney, N.) Rye, F. G.
Cockerill, Brig.-General Sir G. K. Hudson, R.S. (Cumberl'nd, Whiteh'n) Samuel, A. M. (Surrey, Farnham)
Cope, Major William Huntingfield, Lord Samuel, Samuel (W'dsworth, putney)
Courtauld, Major J. S. Hurd, Percy A. Sandeman, A. Stewart
Cowan, Sir Wm. Henry (Islington, N.) Hurst, Gerald B. Savery, S. S.
Craig, Ernest (Chester, Crewe) Hutchison, G. A. Clark (Midl'n & P'bl's) Shepperson, E. W.
Cralk, Rt. Hon. Sir Henry Jones, G. W. H. (Stoke Newington) Skelton, A. N.
Curzon, Captain Viscount King, Captain Henry Douglas Slaney, Major P. Kenyon
Davies, Maj. Geo. F. (Somerset,Yeovil) Knox, Sir Alfred Smith, R.W. (Aberd'n & Kinc'dine. C.)
Davies, Sir Thomas (Cirencester) Looker, Herbert William Somerville, A. A. (Windsor)
Davies, Dr. Vernon Lougher, L. Stanley, Col. Hon. G. F. (Will'sden, E.)
Dawson, Sir Philip Lowe, Sir Francis William Steel, Major Samuel Strang
Dean, Arthur Wellesley Lucas-Tooth, Sir Hugh Vere Streatfield, Captain S. R.
Drewe, C. Luce, Major-Gen. Sir Richard Harman Sueter, Roar-Admiral Murray Fraser
Eden, Captain Anthony MacAndrew, Major Charles Glen Sugden, Sir Wilfrid
Edmondson, Major A. J. MacIntyre, Ian Thom, Lt. Col. J. G. (Dumbarton)
Elliot, Major Walter E. McLean, Major A. Thomson, Rt. Hon. Sir W. Mitchell-
Elveden, Viscount McNeill, Rt. Hon. Ronald John Titchfield, Major the Marquess of
Everard, W. Lindsay Macquisten, F. A. Waddington, R.
Fanshawe, Commander G. D. Mac Robert, Alexander M. Wallace, Captain D. E.
Fielden, E. B. Maitland, Sir Arthur D. steel- Ward, Lt.-Col. A. L.(Kingston-on-Hull)
Finburgh, S. Makins, Brigadier-General E. Warner, Brigadier-General W. W.
Forestier-Walker, Sir L. Malone, Major P. B. Warrender, Sir Victor
Foxcroft, Captain C. T. Manningham-Buller, Sir Mervyn Waterhouse, Captain Charles
Frece, Sir Walter de Margesson, Captain D. Wells, S. R.
Ganzoni, Sir John Marriott, Sir J. A. R. Williams, Herbert G. (Reading)
Gault, Lieut. -Col. Andrew Hamilton Merrlman, F. B. Windsor-Clive, Lieut.-Colonel George
Gibbs, Col. Rt. Hon. George Abraham Meyer, Sir Frank Winterton, Rt. Hon. Earl
Goff, Sir Park Mitchell, W. Foot (Saffron Walden) Wise, Sir Fredric
Graham, Fergus (Cumberland, N.) Monsell, Eyres, Com. Rt. Hon. B. M. Womersley, W. J.
Greene, W. P. Crawford Moore, Lieut.-Colonel T. C. R. (Ayr) Wood, B. C. (Somerset, Bridgwater)
Grotrian, H. Brent Moore, Sir Newton J. Wood, E. (Chest'r, Stalyb'ge & Hyde)
Guinness, Rt. Hon. Walter E. Moreing, Captain A. H. Wood, Sir H. K. (Woolwich, West)
Gunston, Captain D. W. Murchison, C. K. Yerburgh, Major Robert D. T.
Hacking, Captain Douglas H. Neville, R. I. Young, Rt. Hon. Hilton (Norwich)
Hammersley, S. S. Newman, Sir R. H. S. D. L. (Exeter)
Hanbury, C. Newton, Sir D. G. C. (Cambridge) TELLERS FOR THE AYES.—
Harvey, G. (Lambeth, Kennington) Nuttall, Ellis Mr. F. C. Thomson and Captain
Haslam, Henry C. O'Connor, T. J. (Bedford, Luton) Lord Stanley.
Hawke, John Anthony Oman, Sir Charles William C.
Adamson, W. M. (Staff., Cannock) Greenall, T. March, S.
Attlee, Clement Richard Greenwood, A. (Nelson and Colne) Maxton, James
Baker, J. (Wolverhampton, Bilston) Grenfell, D. R. (Glamorgan) Mitchell, E. Rosslyn (Paisley)
Baker, Walter Grundy, T. W. Montague, Frederick
Barnes, A. Hall, F. (York, W. R., Normanton) Morrison, R. C. (Tottenham, N.)
Batey, Joseph Hall, G. H. (Merthyr Tydvil) Murnin, H.
Bromfield, William Hardie, George D. Naylor, T. E.
Bromley, J. Hartshorn, Rt. Hon. Vernon Oliver, George Harold
Brown, James (Ayr and Bute) Hayday, Arthur Paling, W.
Buchanan, G. Hayes, John Henry Parkinson, John Allen (Wigan)
Buxton, Rt. Hon. Noel Henderson, T. (Glasgow) Potts, John S.
Charleton, H. C. Hirst, G. H. Purcell, A. A.
Clowes, S. Hirst, W. (Bradford, South) Rees, Sir Beddoe
Cluse, W. S. Hudson, J. H. (Hudderaneld) Richardson, R. (Houghton-le-Spring)
Clynes, Rt. Hon. John R. John, William (Rhondda, West) Roberts, Rt. Hon. F. O. (W.Bromwich)
Compton, Joseph Johnston, Thomas (Dundee) Robinson, W.C. (Yorks, W. R.,Elland)
Dalton, Hugh Jonas, Henry Haydn (Merioneth) Sexton, James
Davies, Rhys John (Westhoughton) Jones, Morgan (Caerphilly) Slesser, Sir Henry H.
Day, Colonel Harry Jones, T. I. Mardy (Pontypridd) Smith, Ben (Bermondsey, Rotherhithe)
Dennison, R. Kelly, W. T. Smith, H. B. Lees- (Keighley)
Duckworth, John Kennedy, T. Snowden, Rt. Hon. Philip
Duncan, c. Kirkwood, D. Stamford, T. W.
Dunnico, H. Lawson, John James Stephen, Campbell
Edwards. C. (Monmouth, Bedwellty) Lee, F. Sutton, J. E.
Edwards, J. Hugh (Accrington) Lindley, F. W. Taylor, R. A.
England, Colonel A. Lowth, T. Thomas, Sir Robert John (Anglesey)
Forrest, W. Lunn, William Thorne, G. R. (Wolverhampton, E.)
Gardner, J. P. MacDonald, Rt. Hon. J. R.(Aberavon) Thurtle, Ernest
Gosling, Harry MacLaren, Andrew Tinker, John Joseph
Graham, Rt. Hon. Wm. (Edin., Cent.) Maclean, Nell (Glasgow, Govan) Townend, A. E.
Trevslyan, Rt. Hon. C. P. Wheatley, Rt. Hon. J. Wright, W.
Varley, Frank B. Wiggins, William Martin Young, Robert (Lancaster, Newton)
Viant, S. P. Williams, C. P. (Denbigh, Wrexham)
Walsh, Rt. Hon. Stephen Williams, David (Swansea, East] TELLERS FOR THE NOES.—
Webb. Rt. Hon. Sidney Williams, T. (York, Don Valley) Mr. Fenby and Mr. Percy Harris.
Westwood, J. Wilson, C. H. (Sheffield, Attercliffe)