§ 1. Captain WEDGWOOD BENNasked the Minister of Pensions if he can make any statement as to the transfer of pensions administration from Edinburgh to London; and whether he received any intimation that a large number of Scottish Members of Parliament desired the postponement of any action until an opportunity had been given for the discussion of the matter in the House of Commons?
§ The MINISTER of PENSIONS (Major Tryon)I do not think I can add anything to the reply I gave on this subject to the hon. Member for Edinburgh East on the 18th instant, of which I am sending him a copy.
§ Captain BENNHas the right hon. Gentleman received a request from the majority of the Scottish Members to postpone it, and does he not think that such a request is worthy of attention?
§ Major TRYONCentralisation of the Scottish Regional Office is not the present issue, but at a time when in the last two years the reduction of the staff in Scotland is already behind the reduction of the staff in England, I am not prepared to postpone small administrative reforms.
§ Captain BENNIs the answer to my question that the right hon. Gentleman attaches no importance to a representation of this kind from the majority of the Scottish Members?
§ 6 and 7. Mr. NEIL MACLEANasked the Minister of Pensions (1) whether he is aware that on Tuesday, 3rd November, all the files relating to the cases of Widows', Dependants', and Alternative Pensions were removed from the Edinburgh pensions office to London; whether contractors have been invited to tender estimates for the removal of the remaining files, which relate to soldiers' cases, to London; and whether accommodation has already been made for the carrying on at Acton of all pensions work relating to Scotland;
(2) whether he is aware that assurances were given by his Department that nothing would be done to remove the oases of soldiers' pensions from Edinburgh to London until the Scottish Advisory Council had been consulted; whether any such consultation has taken place; if so, what decision has been arrived at as a result of the consultation; and, if no consultation has taken place, whether any instructions for the removal of those cases will be stopped until the opinion of the Scottish Advisory Council has been obtained?
§ Major TRYONAs I informed the hon. Member for Elland on the 24th instant, no decision has yet been taken on the question of re-centralisation of the Ministry's Sub-office in Edinburgh, and before a decision is taken the Advisory Council will be given an opportunity of expressing their views. The awards files of Widows', Dependants', and Alternative Pensions have been transferred from Edinburgh to London. No steps whatever have been taken to invite estimates for the removal of the remaining files to London or to re-arrange the existing accommodation in Acton for carrying on the work there of the Regional Headquarters in Edinburgh.
§ Captain BENNDid not the Undersecretary state yesterday that it had already been decided to do away with the Scottish centre?
§ Major TRYONNo, I have a copy of his reply. He said that, as the leaders 1563 of this movement recognise, it is ultimately inevitable, but no decision to abolish the Scottish region had been arrived at.
§ Mr. MACLEANAre we to take it that Scotland is not to have any administration of pensions at all in the place where they know the individuals, and where it would be much more expeditious to see the cases and carry through the work of each case instead of transferring them to London?
§ Major TRYONScotland in this matter has never had Home Rule. When this region is abolished, Scotland will be in the same position as the Irish Free State, Northern Ireland and the Welsh people.
§ Mr. MACLEANI am not questioning Home Rule. I am questioning the efficiency of administration. The other day I was ruled out of order for bringing Home Rule into a supplementary question I was putting. The Minister of Pensions is in the same predicament to-day. Will the Minister stop all this removing, until he has had an opportunity of consulting with the Advisory Committee and also with Scottish Members on the matter?
§ Sir HENRY CRAIKIs it not the case that what we have to consider is, not the share of administration of this place or that, but the efficiency of administration in the interest of those who are concerned in the distribution of pensions?
§ Mr. LAWSONThe right hon. Gentleman says the opinion of the Advisory Council will be asked. If the Advisory Committee advises against the removal, will that opinion be acceded to?
§ Major TRYONIt has never been the part of the duty of the Advisory Council to settle matters of internal administration of the staff of the Ministry in view of the Act of 1921. On the main issue, I have already said I am prepared to hear what the views are of the Scottish Advisory Council. The main issue is one of efficiency, and it is quite clear that for many years past the most difficult cases have been settled in London.
§ Major TRYONNo, it never has been the rule in matters of distribution of staff for the Advisory Council to be consulted. But on the main issue I am prepared to ascertain their views.
§ Mr. MACLEANWere no assurances given to the Scottish Council that they would be consulted before any such step was taken as has already been taken?
§ Major TRYONNo. It is not the case that we undertook to consult them as to minor movements of the staff, but it is the case that we are prepared to obtain their views before the main issue is decided.
§ Mr. MACLEANI beg to give notice that at an early date I will raise the question of the Motion for the Adjournment.
§ Captain BENNWill the right hon. Gentleman give an hour or two for Scottish Members to discuss the question during the present Session?
§ Mr. SPEAKERThat does not rest with the right hon. Gentleman.