HC Deb 19 February 1920 vol 125 cc1016-8
13. Lieut.-Commander KEN WORTHY

asked the Chief Secretary for Ireland how many hon. Members of this House, representing Irish constituencies, are now in prison or under arrest by the military; how many aldermen and councillors, respectively, elected to Irish local governing bodies are in prisoner under arrest; and whether these arrests are leading to an improvement in the internal condition of Ireland?

Mr. MACPHERSON

Four Members of this House, representing Irish Constituencies, are now in prison. One alderman and eleven councillors are in prison, and five councillors are interned. I hope that the effect suggested in the last part of the question will be produced.

Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHY

Has the hon. Member for St. Stephen's Green (Mr. T. Kelly) been released; and, if so, will he be permitted to carry out his duties as Lord Mayor of "Dublin?

Mr. MACPHERSON

The hon. Member for St. Stephen's Green has been released, but his order for deportation has not been revoked.

Captain W. BENN

Has any charge been made against this hon. Member?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have already stated in this House that he, along with a good many others, has been deported under Section 14 (b) of the Defence of the Realm regulations.

Mr. J. JONES

Is it true that the Lord Mayor of Dublin is now confined in a private mental hospital in consequence of his treatment?

Mr. MACPHERSON

No, I am not aware of that, but I am aware that he is not very well.

Captain BENN

Will the right hon. Gentleman tell us now what is the offence that this hon. Gentleman has committed?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have stated it again and again, and I think in answer to a question by the hon. and gallant Gentleman.

Colonel WEDGWOOD

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that one of these Members of Parliament who is in prison volunteered to fight in the War and on the "Clyde," and went all through the Gallipoli campaign; and, in view of that fact, will he consider the question of his release?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I am also aware that the hon. Member was arrested and escaped from prison, and that the charge on which he was arrested was that of inciting to murder the police.

Mr. DEVLIN

Does the right hon. Gentleman propose to introduce a Bill for the future Government of Ireland while elected representatives of the people are in prison, and does he think that it will promote the proper consideration of those proposals if these elected representatives are kept in prison, when, as a matter of fact, the future government of their country is being discussed in Parliament?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I do not sec how the question arises. These particular representatives have chosen not to come to this Parliament.

Mr. DEVLIN

Cannot these hon. Gentlemen discuss the Government proposals in Ireland? Does the right hon. Gentleman think that representatives of the people should be debarred the right of considering a question of life and death to the future of their country?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have repeatedly stated to the House that no man in Ireland need be in prison if he obeys the law.

Captain REDMOND

What law?

Mr. J. JONES

Whose law?

Mr. MACPHERSON

The coercion is entirely on the other side and not on the side of the Government. His Excellency and myself are determined to maintain law and order.

Mr. DEVLIN

What law have they broken? I would respectfully point out that, if a Member of Parliament be arrested, we are entitled in this House to ask what is the charge upon which he has been arrested. The House and the British people are entitled to know what these men are being kept in prison for.

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have already stated publicly in this House the reason these men have been deported.

Mr. DEVLIN

rose in his place—

Mr. DONALD

On a point of Order. There are 175 Questions on the Paper. Surely other hon. Members have a right to be given a chance as well, instead of the whole of the time of the House being taken up with these nonsensical questions.

Mr. DEVLIN

The hon. Member is a good judge of nonsense. The right hon. Gentleman stated that he has already re peated the precise charges against these men who are now in prison. Has he stated the charge against Alderman Kelly, M. P., Lord Mayor of Dublin?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have already stated to the House that Alderman Kelly, along with others, was deported under Section 14 (b) of the existing Defence of the Realm Regulations for conduct prejudicial to the safety of the Realm.

Mr. DEVLIN

rose in his place—

Mr. SPEAKER

The hon. Member has had his answer. I think we must now pass on.

Mr. DEVLIN

On a point of Order. The right hon. Gentleman has stated that he did give a definite and precise answer, namely, that the charge against these men and against Alderman Kelly was that of doing something prejudicial to the welfare of the State. That is a generalisation. I want an answer from the right hon. Gentleman as to what is the definite and precise charge against these men?

Mr. SPEAKER

The hon. Member had better put down a question.