HC Deb 14 March 1919 vol 113 cc1651-8

In the application of this Act to Scotland—

  1. (a) the twenty-eighth day of May shall be substituted for Lady Day and the local authority under the Public Health (Scotland) Act, 1897, shall be substituted for the sanitary authority;
  2. (b) as from the commencement of the extended period the principal Act shall be amended by the insertion in proviso (iv) of Sub-section (1) of Section one, after the word "dwelling-house" where first occurring therein, of the words "or where by the law of Scotland owners'rates are chargeable on the landlord of any dwelling-house."

Mr. N. MACLEAN

I beg to move to leave out paragraph (b).

I move this Amendment with the object of getting some further information with regard to this paragraph, which was moved this morning by the Secretary for Scotland. I understood him to say that any increase in the rates of a house in Scotland will be put, not, as at present, half upon the occupier and half upon the owner, but that the increase will be put wholly upon the occupier. That is establishing, Ithink, a new precedent for Scotland, and I move this Amendment to ascertain whether it is really the intention of the Government to put forward a new method of assessing the taxation upon the Scottish tenant. I think it was rather stealing a march upon the Scottish Members for the Secretary of Scotland to bring it in this morning in this manner, without giving adequate notice that he was going to start a new taxation principle in Scotland and carry it through in the Rent Restrictions Bill. It seems, if his Amendment is correct, that upon the lower-rented houses there is going to be anything like 25s. saddled upon the tenants, which means an increase in rent to them. On the higher-rented houses it will mean more, increasing as the rent goes up.

I have some experience of what has happened in Scotland during the past eighteen months in regard to the attempts made by landlords where the assessment of a house has been increased, and where that assessment has been compounded with the rent, and the proprietoror factor of the house has endeavoured to get a little extra out of the house by increasing the assessment rate which had been levied even where that assessment rate only amounted to a few coppers a month upon the rent of the house. We have found proprietors and factors trying to get more than the actual assessed rate, representing to the tenant that he ought to pay more, and charging more; as a consequence there has been friction, notices of eviction, rent strikes, and the picketing of houses even within the last month or two. If this particular Clause means what I understand it to mean, then I am certain that trouble in Scotland, so far from being allayed, is going to be increased, in consequence of the attempt which is likely to be made to saddle what atthe present time is recognised by the Scottish people as the owners'tax, and making the tenant pay on property that the landlord is drawing rent from.

Mr. ADAMSON

I am sorry that the Secretary for Scotland is not present at the moment. I want to join my hon. Friend who has just sat down in expressing regret that the Secretary for Scotland has seen fit, on such short notice, to introduce an Amendment that means the upsetting of the basis of assessment in Scotland. As my hon. Friend has already pointed out, we have had a different method of charging assessment in Scotland to England. In connection with this Amendment I am certain that many Scottish Members will not like the idea of such a drastic change being proposed at such short notice. I was hopeful that if the right hon.and learned Gentleman had been present he might have been prevailed upon to agree to the deletion of this paragraph (b) of the Clause which he moved in the Committee stage. If it is allowed to stand part of the Bill it will lead to dissatisfaction and trouble. As hon. Members are perhaps aware, in the first instance the necessity for the Rent Restrictions Act had its origin in certain industrial parts of Scotland. This present Amendment will, I fear, intensify the dissatisfaction that exists in connection with housing conditions. The Amendment raises an issue which I do not think ought to have been raised. It is very unfortunate. If we cannot get some modification we shall have to divide the House in order to express our dissatisfaction with what has been done by the Secretary for Scotland in the Committee stage.

Sir G. HEWART

I regret that for the moment my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary for Scotland is not in the House. The principal Act provides that in certain cases an increase of rates is not to be deemed an increase of rent for the purposes of the Act, and, as that Act stands, those cases are cases where the landlord pays the rates chargeable on, or which by some other Act relating to compounding would be chargeableupon, the occupier of any dwelling. In other words, to put it shortly, the Act is dealing with what we call the case of the compounding householders. My right hon. and learned Friend in making the amending Bill fit with the case of Scotland proposed to add after the words "dwelling-house" the words "or where by the law of Scotland owner's rates are chargeable on the landlord of any dwelling-house." The effect, therefore, would be this: that where under the Scottish law owners' rates are chargeable on the landlord of any dwelling-house—which, I take it, is analogous to the position of the compounding householder in England—the increase in the rent is not deemed to be an increase for the purpose of the Act if the amount does not exceed any increase in the amount for the time being payable by the landlord in respect of these rates. The intention I should have thought was in this respect to bring the law relating to this class of property in Scotland on to the same plane as that relating to the compounding householder in England. However, I am glad to see that the Secretary for Scotland is now here, and I have no doubt he will deal with the matter, and, if need be correct what I have said.

Mr. R. YOUNG

Hon. Members who have preceded me have protested against the idea that we were to be caught napping on this particular point. The Secretary for Scotland put forward a statement which seemed to us to be clear. As he also explained, the law of rating in Scotland is different, in some respects, from that in England. Under the paragraph which the hon. Gentleman has moved (paragraph (b)) we have now given the landlord power to recover not only that portion which the tenant pays directly himself, but the other portion which in Scotland always has been paid by the property owner, and that is also to be put upon the tenant. That is the position, and we think it is unfair because it alters the method that has been pursued for a considerable number of years if not in the whole of Scotland at least in the major part of that country. I would point out that this provision which is now being enacted will add considerably to the difficulties in Glasgow, where the problem is now acute, and the rents are very high, and by adding this small portion to the already high rents to the class of houses there, industrial discontent is going to be greatly intensified. Our objection is that the method has been altered and at short notice in such a way that the equal proportion hitherto paid between the tenant and the property owners is now set aside. There are also great difficulties in front of some of us because we foresee even in this temporary measure the beginning of trouble in the days to come. I hope the Secretary for Scotland will explain why this provision has been thrust upon us, and I hope he will agree to its deletion.

Mr. MUNRO

I am very sorry that I did not hear the speeches on this subject. I thought I had made the point fairly clear when I moved the Amendment in Committee. The reason of the Amendment is that there is a difference between the rating system in Scotland and in England. In England, at the present time, all the rates are paid by the occupier with very few exceptions. The net result is that the English landlord can, by virtue of the existing law and under the Act now being amended, add to his rent every penny which is added to the rates, and can secure his net rental just as it existed before the War. That was the intention of the Act of 1915, namely, that the English house proprietor should continue to draw his pre-war standard rent, and that if his rates were raised he might add to the rent every penny by which the rates were raised.

Mr. ADAMSON

You provided the same percentage for the Scottish landlord.

Mr. MUNRO

That is exactly my point, and I think I can show the right hon. Gentleman that he is under a misapprehension in what he has said. But I am now dealing with England, where the landlord can raise his rent by every penny which is added to the rates, and so secure his pre-war net rental. In Scotland the position is entirely different for this reason, that the rates in Scotland are leviable partly upon the owner and partly upon the tenant. Now if my hon. Friends will look at the Clause of the Act of 1915, they will find that the Scottish house proprietor is only entitled to increase his rent by the amount by which the occupier's rates have been increased. In that particular the Scottish landlord is in a disadvantageous position as compared with the English owner. The purpose of this Clause is to put the Scottish house owner in the same position as the English house owner. The Scottish landlord to-day can only recover and increase his rent by the amount whereby the occupier's rates have increased. But he cannot increase his rent by the amount whereby the rates payable by the owner have increased, and to that extent he is in a different position to the house owner on this side of the Border.

The Hunter Committee, which went into this matter very fully, made a definite recommendation that, as a matter of fairness and equity between house owners on this side and house owners on the other side of the Border, there should be an Amendment made to the effect of the Amendment which I have moved. In moving that Amendment I am carrying out the express recommendation of the Hunter Committee for the purpose of placing the house owner in Scotland in precisely the same position, no better and no worse, than the house owner in England. My hon. Friend opposite and the right hon. Gentleman opposite, who are opposing this proposal, desire that the owner of house property in Scotland should be placed in a worse position than he is in England. In Scotland the tenant is not in any worse position than the tenant in England. The purpose of the Amendment is to place theScottish house owner and tenant in tie same position as the English house owner and tenant. If hon. Members think that the landlords in Scotland should be placed in a worse position than in England, then I do not agree with them. Therefore I suggest that an Amendment which has for its object the carrying out of the Report of the Hunter Committee, which places the Scottish house owner in the same position as the English house owner, and the tenant in no worse position in Scotland than in England, is an entirely reasonable Amendment which ought to command the assent of the Committee.

Amendment negatived.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Bill be now read the third time."

Mr. LORDEN

I understand that I shall now be in order in making a protest against an omission from this measure. My protest is that it does not deal with the question of rating, and this is a very serious defect, because wherever the compound limit is exceeded it will add to the rates because it will do away with the compounding, and the tenant will be liable for paying the addition. In the end I am afraid it will result in extra assessment, and this will mean an extra increase of rent, and you will keep on in a vicious circle. Consequently the Act will practically have no effect at all, and it will only create a great amount of unrest, particularly between landlord and tenant, which does not exist to-day. I think that is a grave defect in the Bill. The Hunter Committee recommended in Clause 46 of their Report as follows:— The result of making an increase in rent which we recommend will be that the rateable value of houses will be increased, and this in its turn will be likely to cause increases in rates, and consequently further additions to rents to cover the increased rates. This will cause a great deal of extra friction which we think might well be avoided during this exceptional period. We therefore recommend that the rateable value of houses should not be increased during the continuance of these restrictions in consequence of the additions to rents which we recommend should be permitted. This recommendation will not, of course, include alterations of rateable value due to other causes. That seems to me to be a great defect in the Bill, and the Government ought to take some steps to remedy it. There is not the slightest doubt that it will have that effect, because, though many rating authorities will not be keen to increase the assessment, they are linked to other rating authorities and have very little control over it. I served on an assessment committee for a number of years, and I went through one quinquennial valuation, so that I know the effect that this is likely to have. There will be a large increase in rating, and that is a defect in the Bill. An Amendment which I had in Committee dealing with Schedule A tax was ruled out. The tax under Schedule A is based on the gross rate, less one-sixth, and if you put 10 per cent. on to the gross rent up goes Schedule A tax immediately. That is practically going to doaway with the effect of the Bill. I was very sorry that Amendment was ruled out upon the score that it did not come within the scope of the Bill. The Bill attempts to deal with certain points in the Hunter Committee's report, but it has left out others which are absolutely vital to make the thing work properly. I hope that the Government will see their way to put something into the Bill to prevent this vicious circle being continued, because the rating authorities will say that it is their duty to put up the assessment. It seems to me very stupid and landlord will claim to be entitled to add that to the rent, and the rating authorities will then say that they are again entitled to increase the assessment. It seems to me very stupid and wrong, and it is a great pity that the Amendment was not allowed to be moved. Probably it was quite right to rule it out, but the title of the Bill should have included the necessary increase in the rent. I do press upon the Government even at this late stage to take steps toprevent what is going to upset the whole of this emergency legislation. It is a very serious defect in the Bill, and I hope that they will give us some idea how it can be dealt with before the Third Reading is taken.

Mr. ROWLANDS

I desire to thank the Government for having listened to the great demand of the public throughout the country to deal with the grievances which have arisen, especially among those outside the scope of the Act of 1915. Taking all things into consideration, the Government have responded very well indeed, and in a broad spirit have done what is required to meet the emergency. We are all aware that this is emergency legislation, but it is only one of a series of emergency Acts that have been passed from time to time to meet an abnormalstate of things which the War has brought about. I thank the Government sincerely, and I am sure that their action will be appreciated in the country and that they will earn the gratitude of a large section of the community. I thank them for some of the concessions that they have made, but there is always something of Oliver Twist about us, and we should have liked a little more than we have got. I desire to thank the two right hon. Gentlemen who have had charge of the Bill. We are used to the urbanity and kindness of the Minister for Education in connection with any measure of which he has charge. They have listened with due consideration to the cases which have been put from various quarters of the House, and on the whole the concessions that have been made are of a generous character. The Attorney-General has shown that clearness and capacity that healways shows. His enunciation of the position taken up by the Government, and of the reasons why he could not accept that which we desired him to accept, was as clear on this occasion as it has always been, and we appreciate the way in which hehas conducted this measure through the House. I do not expect that the Government will make any further alteration in the measure, but I sincerely hope that it will come back to us from another place in the form in which it is at the present time, so that it may speedily be placed on the Statute Book, and that those who are in a state of anxiety owing to the notices that they have received and the position in whichthey have been placed will feel themselves relieved of their worry, and know that they now have the protection of this Bill.

Bill accordingly read the third time, and passed.