HC Deb 21 March 1918 vol 104 cc1274-90
Mr. FIELD

I understood that the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Food was to be present, and the hon. Member for Sligo and myself gave notice that we intended to raise certain points. I would like to know more particularly about the Birkenhead business, and what arrangements have been made regarding that the demands made by the Irish Cattle Dealers' and Stock Owners' Association, and set forth in a communication; sent to the hon. Gentleman. I understood there was a question on the Paper to-day the reply to which was expected to give us fuller information. It is, I think, desirable in the interest both of the men who rear the live stock and of the consumers in this country that all possible friction should be avoided with regard to the importation of live stock into England. There can be no doubt that what is called the Birkenhead ring seems to be a peculiar arrangement which pleases practically nobody. Let me explain what it means. There has been an association formed calling itself the Birkenhead Association, the members of which pay £25 and give a guarantee of an entrance fee of £100 in order to be afforded the privilege of selling at Birkenhead lairage. They have assumed to themselves this extraordinary position, that they will not allow anybody in except somebody who passes muster as one of themselves. I know at least two instances of two men who have been associated with that market since it was opened and who sent live stock to Birkenhead and were refused. That is the kind of thing which ought not to be permitted by this House and ought not to have been arranged, as I understand it was, by the Ministry of Food. I hope that the Parliamentary Secretary will be able to give an explanation as to why such a system has been allowed to go on at Birkenhead. There are two or three specific complaints in connection with this matter which have been sent by the Cattle Traders' Association to the Ministry of Food. There are questions as to free sale, flat rates, and other minor points, and I trust in these respects that something will be done to meet the demand of the cattle traders.

7.0 P.M.

The other point I wish to raise is as to the price of pigs. Some hon. Members may say that these are rather curious matters to raise on an Adjournment Motion, but, after all, if you want food, of which we have a certain amount, and if anything can be done in order to provide that food for the community it is a service to the State. Therefore it is because not alone that I happen to be connected with this trade, but also in the public interest, I bring forward these matters so that the Ministry of Food may be able to arrange them and carry out their functions to the satisfaction of all concerned. I am glad to see that the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Food is now in the House. I had a conversation with him this evening and informed him of the points I intended to raise. I am told by those who are experts in the pig business that the price fixed for pigs is practically preventing production. You must have production first before you can have the article. If the price is satisfactory you will have the supply of pigs and without pigs you can not produce bacon. If you want Irish bacon in England, unless you get a certain number of pigs, you cannot have that bacon. Bacon factories in Ireland have been seriously affected by reason of the facts that they could not obtain a sufficient number of pigs to keep the men employed going. There are two of those in my own Constituency, one of which employs 300 men and the other 150. Arrangements have been made, I understand, to allow them to obtain a sufficient number of pigs to keep the men going for the time being. The crux of the whole business is price. In fixing a price you have got to take into account the increase in the price of foodstuffs, labour taxation, and all those things which go to make the sum total of the cost to the consumer. The consumer sometimes says that it is the fault of the man who produces or of the business man, but it is really a combination of circumstances which produces the excessive price that has to be met by the consumer. I entirely agree with what was said by the hon. Member who opened this Debate about the sending of food to Germany via Holland from America. I have a cousin, resident for many years in New York. He wrote to me about a year after the commencement of the. War with regard to certain commodities. He had obtained information from Friends of his who were engaged in business in New York that at least seven times the quantity of those food commodities had been sent via Holland to Ger many. I sent that communication to the authorities, and I received a simple civil acknowledgment, but I never received any information as to whether any action was taken on the information which I gave. I do not wish to reopen a discussion which was practically closed, but I am perfectly independent of the Government —and, indeed, of other people, and I think it is well I should add my testimony to what has been stated by the hon. Member who opened this Debate. The only other point to which I wish to allude is the question we discussed last night about the gas Bills. The reason I mention it at all is that I have been asked by the Chamber of Commerce of Dublin, by the Dublin Corporation, and by all the suburban districts to oppose this gas Bill. I dare say I am skating on thin ice in talking about it on this Motion, but I am not going to say more than this: I trust when the House comes to consider these gas Bills they will remember—

Mr. SPEAKER

The hon. Member is not in order in discussing those Bills on this Motion.

Mr. FIELD

I have nothing more to say, except that I hope the hon. Member, when he gives a reply, will enable me to take a message to those I represent that he has given consideration to all the points I have brought to his notice, and that, so far as he can, ho will endeavour to meet the necessities of the case and try to smooth down, as far as possible, all the difficulties that have arisen. We are not all saints—in fact, the majority of us are sinners—and I quite understand the difficulty of the position the hon. Gentleman is in; but if I might give him advice, it would be that, so far as possible, he should consult the men in the, particular business and endeavour to carry out their desires, so that the business he has undertaken will be carried out with the least possible friction.

Mr. SCANLAN

I wish to call the attention of the Government, and especially the Parliamentary representative of the Food Controller, to a matter which does not excite much enthusiasm. The subject is potatoes. Ordinarily there is no very great interest taken in potatoes, but an almost romantic interest has been infused into this question by the week-end message of the Prime Minister to this country, that the country could be saved by potatoes. There are difficulties which the Navy has to contend with and there are great difficulties which the Shipping Controller has to deal with—difficulties which, I am sure, will be shared by Lord Pirrie, and I am sanguine enough to believe that the coming of Lord Pirrie will make a very great difference to the Government in so far as the Shipping Controller is concerned. Whatever success we may have in shipbuilding, it is necessary to preserve supplies of food for this country, and the mainstay of the food supply of this country, as stated by the Prime Minister, is the supply of potatoes. My object in addressing the courteous and efficient representative of the Food Controller to-night is to call his attention, and the attention of the Government, to certain difficulties which arise in regard to the increased production of potatoes in Ireland. Last year the people of Ireland, in response to a demand of the Government, made a most remark-able increase in tillage. We had a great increase in the acreage devoted to cereals, and a great increase in the acreage devoted to potatoes. We produced a very vastly increased amount of potatoes. I have often heard it said outside this House, and sometimes in the House, that the most prosperous country in Europe was Ireland, and certain hon. Friends of mine, who do not think with me as to what should be done about Ireland, are inclined to say with reference to Ireland that the country is now enjoying a prosperity to which it is not entitled. If that means anything, I think it means this: Ireland at the present moment is producing more for England, and for the Empire, than any part of Great Britain, and the only reflection on Ireland, and on the Irish people, which any of my friends who ordinarily differ from me in politics can make, is that the people of Ireland demand for the potatoes and pigs the ordinary market price. I am not going to apologise for that. That is business, and I think there is nothing in which Ireland can more help Britain in this War, help the Allies in this War, and help America, to whom all Ireland looks as a country who has befriended her in past times, and is befriending her now, than by increasing the food supplies avail able for Ireland itself, available for this country, and available for all the Allies; and I respectfully submit that Ireland is not being faithfully dealt with in regard to the production of food.

The people of Ireland are anxious to produce more food. They are anxious to increase the acreage under cereals, and anxious to increase the output of potatoes. But I take this matter of potatoes alone, and let me call the attention of the Parliamentary Secretary to the Food Controller to the fact that quite recently, in the month of January, an arrangement was made in Liverpool between representatives of his Department and representatives of an Irish potato growing association by which the surplus produce of potatoes of the 1917 crop from Ireland was to be sent to Wales and to Liverpool. It was arranged ultimately that a net amount of 5,000 tons per week was to be sent from Ireland to associations, representing consumers in Wales and in Liver pool. When this meeting was called the Irish association were told that they would be asked to supply not 5,000 tons, but 50,000 tons per week, so long as the surplus supply in Ireland was unexhausted. It was agreed that Ireland should supply 5,000 tons per week. What has happened? The potato growers in Ireland produced the supplies, brought the supplies to market, brought the supplies to railway stations and alongside the quays for shipment to this country. The supplies were stopped. The Parliamentary representative of the Food Controller was good enough to say in the House the other day, in answer to a question of mine, that, not withstanding the fact that thousands and thousands of tons of potatoes are now in warehouses and undergoing deterioration, the loss will be made good. But I submit to him that is not the way to answer this question. If it is necessary that the people in this country should be supplied by Irish potato growers, the produce of the potato fields in Ireland should be brought to market and brought to the consumers in this country. They are not being brought to the consumers—why? I do not blame my hon. Friend the Parliamentary representative of the Food Controller, and I do not blame the Food Controller, but I do blame inefficient committees in this country—mere theorists to whom this matter is entrusted, who know nothing about the market, who are out of sympathy with Ireland, and who by their methods are wasting the Irish crop and depriving the people of this country of sources of food to which the people of this country, and especially the poor, are entitled. I respectfully ask the Food Controller to make arrangements whereby it would be possible for the Government to avail themselves of all the surplus of the 1917 crop in Ireland, and not only to pay the people compensation who grow the potatoes, but to have the potatoes brought to market and made available for human food in this country.

There are two other matters on which I am very anxious to speak in reference to potatoes. There are various uses which can be made of potatoes. For instance, potatoes are very much used as an ingredient in flour. They are also used as an ingredient in starch. I am told that in pre-war times the Germans sent to Manchester alone 4,000,000 tons a year of starch made largely from potatoes. This starch is made by machinery. One of our present war developments is the adaptation of everything possible to meet the needs of the community. I believe the Government have commandeered machinery for the manufacture of flour with potatoes as a large ingredient. I want to know from the Parliamentary representative of the Food Controller what machinery there is available for the manufacture of potato flour, and I want to know how much of that machinery we are going to get in Ireland? Ireland is by far the greatest potato-growing country in the United Kingdom, and I submit that, in so far as the Government contemplate the manufacture of flour from potatoes, there should be an installation of machinery for that purpose in Ireland. Under the Defence of the Realm Act, the Government take charge of all the available machinery; the Government know how many machines for the manufacture of flour from potatoes are avail able altogether within their resources in this country. I submit that a fair proportion of the available machinery should be installed in Ireland, and I ask my hon. Friend to state to us to-night what machinery is available, and what proportion of that machinery he proposes to instal in Ireland. [An HON. MEMBER: "And where!"] That is as regards potato flour. The same thing applies to farina. Farina is a starchy substance. There is an amount of machinery being manufactured to the order of the Government for this purpose, and we ought to have a proportion of that machinery for Ireland. I want my hon. Friend to be quite frank with us, and to tell us for all those purposes of manufacture what the amount of machinery is; how many machines are to be set up in Ireland, and where they are to be installed.

With reference to the question of cattle, and prices generally, I am glad to see that the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Trinity College is here, because I have always observed this in connection with Irish Debates in the House of Commons, that there has been one question on which all Irishmen have always been united, and that has been in demanding that in regard to expenditure Ireland should get her fair share. We are not getting our fair share for potatoes. The Prime Minister, in a speech in February, I think, of 1916, said that there was to be a flat rate, guaranteed by the Government, of £6 per ton for potatoes. This has been cut down by the Food Controller, Lord Rhondda, and I am sure, unwillingly, by his very capable representative in this House. This was cut down so as to deprive the small growers of potatoes of the guarantee of £6 per ton. I received a letter yesterday from, a landlord in my Constituency. I am not a great friend of landlords—very few Nationalists are— but this gentleman pointed out to me that he has sold his potatoes at £3 per ton. He does not ask for any sympathy, because, he says, he can get the difference between £3 and £6 made up by the Government; but he draws my attention to this. "What about my labourers," he says—"my labourers who take conacre for me—who grow potatoes on small patches of my estate which I let to them? They are growing potatoes for the same purpose that I am—for the same national demand, and at the same time for their own profit. They are left entirely out of consideration by the Government. I get my £6 per ton, but my labourers do not get it." One of the meanest actions in connection with the food potato question has been that of the Food Controller in depriving small growers of the guarantee of the Government. The Prime Minister said that so far as potatoes were concerned for 1917 there was going to be a flat rate guaranteed by the Government of £6 per ton. When the Prime Minister made that statement, he bound the Government and bound Parliament, and under it potatoes have been grown in this country, the general understanding being that every man who grew potatoes, whether he were a small holder or a land lord controlling a great acreage, should receive a flat rate of £6 per ton. I appeal to the Government, now, to redeem that pledge, and to make it good to the people to whom it means most—that is, to the smallest men, the people who are not able to bring four tons at a time into the market. With reference to the price of potatoes for next year, let me point out this difference to the representative of the Food Controller. The price paid in Ireland does not take account of freight and insurance. The Scotch farmer, the English farmer, or the Welsh farmer can cart his goods to the nearest railway station, and when he has deposited them at the railway station he is entitled to the maxi mum price allowed by the Government. Not so in Ireland. In Ireland the price is diminished by reason of the fact that the farmer and the producer have to pay freight and insurance, and, of course, that means a very considerable difference. The Government have taken over the rail ways; thy have largely taken over steam ship traffic—they should take over the whole of the steamship traffic for the conveyance of foodstuffs between Ireland and this country and, of course, from this country to Ireland in the same way. I submit that the farmer in the West of Ire land is as much entitled to the full price for his produce, whether it be cereals, potatoes or live-stock, as the farmer in Cornwall or Aberdeenshire. The Government are entitled to make full use of the railway facilities in this country. May I respectfully ask the Government and the Food Controller to re-examine this question, with a view to enabling those of us who represent Ireland to say to our constituents, and to the country, that the best service which Ireland can render at the present time is to increase her food supply? But, if she is to increase her food supply, she should get fair play; and the Irish farmer and the Irish producer are entitled to equal consideration with the farmer and producer in this country.

Mr. REA

I desire to ask for an assurance from my hon. Friend opposite on one small point, which is nevertheless of considerable importance to a number of health resorts in this country which are expecting a certain influx of visitors at Easter time. We are all aware that the Government are desirous of limiting the amount of travelling at Easier, and we all sympathise with them, and shall do what we can to prevent unnecessary travel. But it must be admitted that there will be a certain influx of visitors into some health resorts, and there is, at the present time, a considerable amount of anxiety about the supplies for these extra visitors. I understand that they have been told that special arrangements will be made to provide this extra food, but so far we have not got anything more than a sort of pious promise that something will be done, and the food authorities are anxious to make their arrangements in good time. I have risen solely for the purpose of asking my hon. Friend if he can give us an assurance that definite instructions as to the procedure which is to be followed in these cases will be sent at once to the local food authorities, so that those concerned, in the health resorts where these people are expected, may be able to satisfy them selves that they will be able to feed their visitors when they arrive?

The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the MINISTRY of FOOD (Mr. Clynes)

I intend, in the short time that I propose to address the House, to limit myself almost entirely to the points that have been raised. Those points, apart from the one just broached, deal mainly with the, question of bacon and potatoes so far as those articles of food affect the food situation in Ireland and the supplies that have come from that country to this. But before dealing with those two main points of detail, I would like to express to the public at large, and to the local authorities throughout the country who are co-operating with the Ministry of Food, the gratitude of the Food Minister for the way in which the restraints and difficulties of a rationing system have been borne and overcome during the course of the past few weeks. I may recall to the House the fact that a feeling of gloom tended to pervade the country in the beginning of the winter, or at any rate in the early part of December last year, and considering what at that time was the prospect and the forecast, we may, I think, without saying too much of our noble selves, congratulate ourselves upon the way in which we have emerged from difficulties that seemed to threaten very serious unrest—and, indeed, very serious trouble—in many parts of the country. The Ministry is indebted to the country and to this House, and to those who have co-operated with it throughout the country, for the great assistance given in a task which it is recognised to be one of extreme complexity and difficulty. I would like, at the same time, to remind the public that we must further draw upon their patience, if only for the reasons that, through the authority of Parliament, and the operations of the Ministry, and the work of the local food committees, the public can justly be said to be enjoying cheaper food than the public of any other belligerent or neutral country concerned closely in this War. Though we are bound to continue to suffer from food shortage, we have been able, in a comparatively short time, not merely to imitate, but greatly to improve upon the systems of organisation and rationing arrangements which long ago were established in some other lands. I regret to say that we are still in many places beset with the troubles produced for us by the profiteer. I speak now not mainly of that type of profiteer whoso great fortunes were made in the early stages of this "War. He, to a very great extent, has been handled by the law, and in some instances severely punished for his offences. It is, however, not too much to Bay that a considerable number of smaller profiteerers have made their appearance, and the matter we have to take in hand now is whether that large section of the public who have taken so many meals away from home in cafes, restaurants, and hotels are being charged a reasonable rate for the less costly food which those places have been supplying. I make no imputations, but I do say that there is a great deal of dissatisfaction and a growing sense of unrest in the minds of many people on this matter, and we are taking steps to inquire as to how far any action may be necessary under this heading. We are still concerned as a Ministry with the second branch of the problem placed in our charge when the Food Ministry was first established.

The first branch is that of prices, and the second is that of supplies. Therefore, having to do all we can to improve supplies, we have to encourage and stimulate home production, and we have to pay any price which is necessary in the circum stances to secure abundant quantities of food, if possible, from other parts of the world I agree heartily with the main arguments of my hon. Friend who addressed the House on the question of the action of Ireland regarding potatoes, and in that respect, as in others, Ireland has done much to relieve this country from difficulty and to supply us with a large supply of that wholesome article of food. I think, however, the hon. Member who. Raised this question is totally misunderstanding the nature of the guarantee which was given repeatedly in this House at the time when the Prime Minister and others on behalf of the Government asked that a larger crop of potatoes should be grown not merely in Ireland but in this country as well. It is not the fact that we have deprived the small potato grower of the benefits of any guarantee given, for that guarantee was never made to apply to the small growers who have so frequently been brought into this question. There can be no considerably increased potato crop by turning to the small grower, and for an abundance of potatoes we hope to turn to those whose tillage enables them to immensely increase their crop, and thus place a much larger stock of potatoes on the market.

Mr. SCANLAN

May I ask how does he qualify, or what authority has he or Lord Rhondda to qualify, the definite statement of the Prime Minister that there was to be a guarantee of £6 per ton for potatoes, irrespective of the amount?

Mr. CLYNES

I accept that statement as applying to the Prime Minister as well as the Food Controller, with the exception of the concluding words, "irrespective of the amount." It is on record that the guarantee was stated not to apply to less than four tons.

Mr. SCANLAN

Certainly not by the Prime Minister.

Mr. FIELD

It was not so understood.

Mr. CLYNES

The question was referred to here on three occasions. On the first occasion there was clearly a reference to the weight, and the weight was then limited to 6 tons, not four.

Mr. SCANLAN

That was after the Prime Minister's statement.

Mr. SPEAKER

I think the hon. Member who has asked these questions ought to listen to the reply without interruption.

Mr. CLYNES

The concession made was that the amount was reduced from 6 tons to four. On the second occasion the Prime Minister, speaking in this House, dealt not with the question of weight at all, but with the price only, and he did not touch the question of weight, but the fact that he did not make any reference to the question of weight on that occasion did not mean that the price which had been fixed, and the price with which he was then alone dealing, was to apply to every body, whether the growers were large or small. That is really the history of the extent to which the Government is committed in this matter. I do not know whether it is practicable, or whether it would be proper, to consider further the claims of the smaller growers. I have no prejudices against their claims, and I agree that the repeated appeals made to home producers to do their best to increase our food supplies may justify such arguments as my hon. Friend opposite has put.

May I make one or two other remarks while on the subject of potatoes. The situation as it has developed in the past few weeks has given rise to a good deal of uneasiness and dissatisfaction among the potato growers in Ireland, or perhaps rather more amongst those who import potatoes for the traders in Liverpool and South Wales. This difficulty has arisen because within a space of a very short time the Government has had to try and import great quantities under conditions of great disadvantage with regard to transport and shipments, and this has caused a congestion which we are seeking to remove rapidly. But the fact that this has happened is traceable to shortages of transport which we have not been able to foresee or overcome. Some of this difficulty is also due to what might be described as strained relations between certain people in the potato trade. In this matter the Government is not exactly the buyer and the seller, and we appear rather in the character of a mediator and supervisor and as one who gives a guarantee that in certain circumstances losses shall be made good. The real buying and selling is done by those who ordinarily pursue this trade. The Government, however, has stepped in, by conferences and mediation, and has done every thing it can to compose these differences, and cause the potatoes to continue to arrive here in large quantities.

I will mention two things as showing how we are seeking, not to prejudice, but, if anything, to favour Ireland in respect of potato supplies compared with other parts of the Kingdom. Not merely have we closed some seven English counties to the use of any potatoes except Irish potatoes, but we have gone further and recently arranged that a large supply of potatoes shall be sent from Ireland to feed the Armies both of the French and the Belgian nations. That is now being done, and the Belgians have been so pleased with what has happened that they are disposed to recognise what has been done by decorating some of those who are interested in the potato supplies of Ireland. As regards machinery and potato flour, I was able to give to the House, in reply to a question, figures showing that we have already allotted fifteen machines, the first consignment for this very purpose, and that Ireland has got the largest supplies of those machines, as compared either with Scotland or England, so that in respect of placing machinery at their disposal and opening up opportunities for the sale of this article everything possible is being done for the Irish potato growers. Fifteen is the number of machines for Ireland.

My hon. Friend has asked me some questions about bacon. In the arrangements with regard to price, no material change has been made, and little or no dissatisfaction is expressed under that heading. There is nothing obscure about the prices, although we find them little understood. With respect to imported bacon, the maximum wholesale price fixed by the Order of 17th November last year still stands.

The retailers allow them a profit of 3d. per lb., which he has also to average over the whole side of bacon. With regard to home-produced bacon, this is governed by the price fixed for pig, and the Ministry has announced that the price for pigs is to be raised by 3s. per score, or 16s. 9d. per cwt. on the dead-weight. We are examining the present wholesale prices under the Order of 17th November. Of course, these prices require revision from time to time. We are aware that this is an urgent matter, and there will be no delay in making any necessary adjustments. Just as we have in the case of other articles of food, like tea and flour, been able to establish one quality—you may say it is either good or bad—alike for all people, rich and poor, we have standardised certain of these articles, and, as a war measure, I think there will be no disapproval of the steps we arc taking. Even in the case of bacon a similar question is now being dealt with, but as a side of bacon varies in quality in some eight or nine directions, I am told it is not an easy matter, but the consumer's interest is the main one which we must keep in mind. We are not hastening any decision towards the end of establishing what might be termed one quality of bacon at one uniform price, because we must retain the good will of the retailers in this matter, and as they say that there are insuperable difficulties in doing what we have now under consideration we are taking them into our counsel, and nothing will be done in this matter except by agreement. I hope that I have now covered all the points raised on this question by hon. Members from Ireland. With regard to the two curing factories, if the hon. Member will refer to a reply I gave a few days ago he will see that, so far as there is bacon available for curing purposes, we are taking all the necessary steps to place at their disposal great quantities to keep them working and to keep the men in employment.

My hon. Friend opposite addressed to me a special question of considerable public interest. He wishes to know what is in contemplation in regard to the necessary provision at public resorts during the spring and summer. We have not, of course, desired on this matter to leave local authorities or the public to depend upon mere general statements. You cannot feed people even in holiday time on vague generalities. If these holi- day resorts are to be maintained, I will not say, at anything like their usual level, but at a level that will accommodate a considerable number of tired, weary workers, soldiers, and ammunition workers, some thing substantial must be done to meet their needs. Of course, what is done will still leave them more or less under the same limitations as to food rations as apply to those who remain at home, so that when we say that steps have been taken to provide additional quantities of food my hon. Friend can take it that that statement is to be relied upon. I under stand that to-day definite instructions are going out to these particular places in order that the local food committees may not be handicapped by receiving their authority too late to meet the needs of the coining Easter. I hope that these places will be able to adapt themselves to the conditions of rationing, and that they will be able to procure under our authority the necessary supplementary supplies of food. I would like, however, to say that the view of the Minister is—and I think it is the view that will be endorsed by this House and by the public at large — that during the spring and summer of this year, in view of the conditions under which we must live, holiday making, the holding of conferences, and the congregating of large bodies of people into these places should not be carried to the point of excess, and, as far as possible, it is better people should remain at home, if they can get the rest and change which will fit them properly for their work. At the same time, we know there will be considerable patronage of those places, and we, therefore, wish to place the public mind at rest by putting quantities of food at their disposal. I think what I have said covers the whole of the points raised during the course of this Debate, and at this late hour I do not wish—

Mr. FIELD

The hon. Gentleman has not said a word about Birkenhead. Has he no information to give us on that point?

Mr. CLYNES

I thought the hon. Member was well content with the answers given respecting the payment of 30s. I do not wish to go into details, but if any hon. Member desires more information, and will approach me, I shall be glad to give him all I can.

Mr. J. F. MASON

I wish to refer to the conditions under which separation allowances are paid to soldiers who have returned to civil occupations. The House is aware that a considerable number of soldiers are now in civil occupations all over the country, the greater number being employed in agriculture. When employers of agricultural labour ask for soldier assistants they naturally in many cases endeavour to get the men whom they have previously employed, and in the same way, when a man finds he is going to be returned to agricultural work, he frequently writes to his former employer to suggest that he should be applied for. I am mentioning this because a large number of these men have been able to return to the places from which they came, and to live in the houses which they formerly occupied with their families, and continue to draw their separation allowances as well as their civil pay. As this is occurring on a large scale, it is involving a very considerable waste of public money, and at the same time it is causing dissatisfaction among other soldiers and civilians who are aggrieved at this special provision for a particular class of men. Let me give one or two instances within my own personal knowledge, and I think they will be fair illustrations of many thousands of cases to be found throughout the country. Some time in last year a carter, who had been with me before he went into the Army, was returned on the application of my bailiff to work on my farm. He lives in a house of mine which he has rent free, he gets his coal, he receives full carter's wages, and I find that all this time he has been drawing a separation allowance, which, of course, puts him on the footing of having nearly double the income of other carters.

But I have hero another case which is really far more inexcusable. It is the case of a gamekeeper, a man of thirty-nine, who had been four times rejected on medical examination, but was finally, although he was far from fit to be a soldier, called up on the 19th January, this year. He was away from home three weeks; he then returned to the house where his wife and family were, a house belonging tome which he had rent free; he continued to live there, and I have only just heard that he has been working for a tenant of mine on full agricultural labourer's wages, approximately the same sum as he received before, and in addition to that his wife is drawing 37s. per week separation allowance. Thus this man, who has returned to the condition in which he was before, continues to wear Government clothes and boots, thereby saving his own, and he is drawing some- thing over £3 a week as against the 25s. which those with whom he is working are getting. That is naturally creating considerable dissatisfaction among the other labourers. Another gamekeeper of mine, who has been on active service and has been abroad for nearly two years, came home the other day on leave, and you can imagine there is some cause for the discontent he expressed seeing that he has been risking his life and doing real soldier's work for 1s. 2d. per day, while when he comes home he finds that this other man, who has only been a soldier three weeks and has never been abroad, is drawing 25s. a week in addition to his separation allowance. I trust some notice will be taken of this. I know the Financial Secretary, who is interested in these matters, has not been able to be present, and I earnestly hope that someone on the Government Bench will draw his attention to these remarks.