REPRESENTATION OF THE PEOPLE [EXPENSES]. (Hansard, 25 June 1917)

§ Colonel SANDERS
I have teen asked, on behalf of the county council of which I am a member, to try to ascertain rather more nearly than we know at present what will be the expenses which the country will incur under the provisions of this Bill. The estimate I have had shown to me makes a very considerable increase in the expenses that will fall 56 upon the country and which will have to be provided out of the county rates. I should be very much obliged if the Home Secretary could give us a little more information than we have at present as to what check there is going to be upon this expenditure, especially under two heads. The first is that of the assistants who are to be appointed, with the approval of the Local Government Board, to help the registration officer. They will in a great many cases have to carry out the functions which are now performed by the revising barristers. It is quite impossible that the registration officer can have time to carry out what will practically be a long series of revision Courts, and he will have to appoint deputies to do that work for him. It is skilled work, and I should think it would be necessary to appoint lawyers to do it, and I should like to know approximately what idea the Government has formed as to the scale that is to be allowed for the remuneration of these assistants. Then there is the question of the registration officer himself, the clerk of the county council, or the town clerk, or whoever he is. Will he have any additional remuneration for the official work that is thrown upon him under this Bill? Then there is the further question of the assistant overseers. In the sixth paragraph of Schedule I. there is this sentence about the expenses of the assistant overseers: Any reasonable expenses incurred by the overseers in performing any duties required of them in pursuance of this rule (including reasonable remuneration where the duties are performed by an assistant overseer) shall be paid by the registration officer as part of the registration expenses. At present all the expenses of the overseers fall not on the county council but on the district council I should like to know who is to regulate the scale at which these expenses will be charged. The money Clause of the Bill provides that the Treasury is to pay half where the expenses do not exceed the maximum amount under a scale to be settled by the Treasury, and, where the expenses exceed that maximum amount, one-half of the maximum amount. That seems to have in view that the Treasury will lay down a scale, I suppose according to the conformation of the constituencies, but I want to know whether any Government Department will issue a scale, not of the total expenses, but of the expenses which 57 are to be incurred under each head—how much you have to pay for overseers and how much for assistant registration officers, and whether there is any extra remuneration which will go to the registration officer himself. If the Home Secretary could enlighten us at all on that subject it would be of great practical utility to the clerks and treasurers of the county councils in framing their future estimates.

§ Mr. ROWLANDS
I should like to ask if we can be put in possession of some information in regard to the amount of the charges to be paid to returning officers. The schedule at present in existence is most exorbitant, extravagant, and ridiculous. The House has on more than one occasion expressed very decided opinions in connection with that scale, and now that an opportunity has arisen when we can have a rational system I would ask the Home Secretary whether he will satisfy the desire of the House by giving us some information in connection with this expenditure. While strongly in favour of the expenses of Parliamentary candidates being paid out of public funds, we want to help the Treasury in protecting the public funds from anything like exorbitant or unnecessary expenditure. I would ask him very carefully to look over the present machinery and some of the criticism which has been passed upon it. Perhaps one of the most able speeches ever delivered against the present Schedule was by the late Lord James, who for the first time in the history of this country got a scale of charges fixed which he himself admitted in 1894 could be reduced by at least one-third, and others who were conversant with the question endorsed the view more strongly, and thought that the scale was absolutely ridiculous. I hope the House will have an opportunity of discussing the scale, because some of us are of opinion that a very simple and inexpensive machinery can be set up which, while relieving candidates of the burden which has rested on them for so many years, ought not to cost the country anything approaching what it is at present. We shall be able to draw comparisons between the charges in various parts of the country and show the enormous difference between county council and Parliamentary elections over the same areas in London.

The CHAIRMAN
That would be anticipating the Third Schedule.

§ Mr. KING
May I appeal in the same sense. It would ease matters if we could have this information.

§ The SECRETARY of STATE for the HOME DEPARTMENT (Sir G. Cave)
As my hon. and gallant Friend (Colonel Sanders) has pointed out, the Exchequer will only pay half the expenses of registration up to a maximum scale supplied by the Treasury. I cannot say exactly how that scale will be divided, but steps will be taken with a view to limiting the expenses of registration. They are today somewhat heavy, and they fall almost entirely upon the local authorities. Under this provision there must, of course, be some increase in the total cost of registration, but only a half will be borne by the local authorities. I think the net result is likely to be a reduction of expense and by no means the alarming increase which my hon. and gallant Friend anticipates. With regard to the other point raised by the hon. Member (Mr. Rowlands) as to returning officers' charges, I agree with my hon. Friend that the charges made are heavier than one would like them to be. I believe the total amount of those charges in the last General Election was about £215,000. Under this Bill they are to be paid according to a scale to be approved under Clause 22. I certainly have it in my mind that the scale to be prescribed in that Clause should be very considerably less than that which is paid at the present time. I hope that the amount that will fall upon the Treasury will not be nearly so great as that which is now paid by the candidates.

§ Mr. LOUGH
I think we have got a very fair answer so far, but I would like to ask before we part with this Bill if the right hon. Gentleman would undertake to give us still more specific details of the rates and expenses which the Treasury is likely to fix. The Resolution is, and necessarily must be, very wide. Although the part which the Home Secretary has explained is all right, I think the matter is so important that we ought to get the exact figures, if possible, before the House parts with this Bill.