HC Deb 20 February 1917 vol 90 cc1134-7
2. Mr. MacVEAGH

asked the Under-Secretary of State for War whether the War Office is willing to appoint immediately a Committee composed of men of high attainments, but not connected with the medical profession, in order to inquire into the question of utilising for the alleviation of the sufferings of wounded soldiers the services of experts in manipulative surgery who do not hold medical degrees?

The UNDER-SECRETARY of STATE for WAR (Mr. Macpherson)

No, Sir.

Mr. J. MASON

Will the hon Gentleman consider the desirability of making use of all science and knowledge, even including that which is mentioned in this question?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have already answered several questions on this subject.

Mr. MacVEAGH

What is the objection of the War Office to the appointment of an independent Committee?

Mr. MACPHERSON

It is a very doubtful proposition to suggest that non-technical men should be put to deal with a technical subject.

Sir J. D. REES

Is it not the fact that it is not the individual medical men who object but the collective Council?

Mr. SWIFT MacNEILL

Is the hon. Gentleman prepared, or, rather, are the Government prepared, to allow men to suffer in the interests of professional trade unionism?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I must protest against that statement.

Mr. MacVEAGH

It is quite true.

Mr. MACPHERSON

Nothing has been more admirable during the whole course of the War than the skill and judgment and effectiveness of the medical profession.

Mr. MacVEAGH

That has nothing to do with the case.

Sir W. COLLINS

While not excluding investigation of any line of particular treatment, from whatever source it may be suggested, may I ask that the hon. Gentleman will have regard to the risks as well as the advantages of unqualified practice?

Mr. MACPHERSON

Certainly.

Mr. MacVEAGH

May I ask the hon. Gentleman if he is aware that five members of his own Government have undergone this treatment, and does he not admit that the life of even one private soldier is more valuable than the whole of the two Front Benches?

Sir C. KINLOCH-COOKE

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there are many officers fighting at the front who would not be there but for this treatment?

Mr. MacVEAGH

Answer!

Mr. SPEAKER

We have already had a number of supplementary questions on this subject.

16 and 17. Mr. MacVEAGH

asked the Under-Secretary of State for War (1) whether a soldier in the West Kent Regiment, W. H. Townley, after being unsuccessfully treated at home and abroad, was discharged from the Army as incurable; and whether he will call for a Report on this man's subsequent medical history; and (2) whether five of the thirty officers of the 7th Oxfords were unfit for military service until they had undergone manipulative treatment; whether they had previously been treated unsuccessfully by medical practitioners; and whether they are now on active service in France?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have no knowledge of the cases brought to notice by my hon. Friend in these questions, and I should be glad if he will give me further particulars.

Mr. MacVEAGH

Does the hon. Gentleman mean to tell me that the Army Medical Department has not seen the letters published in nearly every daily newspaper in the United Kingdom from Lord Kitchener's sister saying that after Townley was examined by ten Army doctors and he was discharged from the Army as incurable, he was cured in five minutes by manipulative treatment? Does the hon. Gentleman say that his Department has not seen the letter?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have not seen it.

Mr. MacVEAGH

I wonder if they know anything about anything!

18. Mr. MacVEAGH

asked whether the medical profession in France is availing itself of the services of experts in manipulative surgery for the treatment of wounded soldiers; and on what grounds the War Office in this country refuses to allow a similar dilution of labour?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have no information on the first part of the question. In regard to the second part of the question, apart from other objections under the terms of the Medical Act, 1858, it is not possible to employ as surgeons in the Military Service any person not registered under that Act.

Mr. MacVEAGH

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the report of the British Medical Committee stated that manipulative surgery was being used in France?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I understand that my hon. Friend is taking an opportunity of debating the subject. It would be much more satisfactory if he did so. I may tell him now that not only have we the finest doctors and surgeons, but we also have the finest possible hospitals where the men are treated.

Mr. MacVEAGH

But the men have not been treated. They admit that. The thing is a public scandal, and you know it!

Mr. SPEAKER

The hon. Member has no right to debate the question now.

19. Mr. MacVEAGH

asked the Under-Secretary of State for War whether he is aware that five generals in the Army and two admirals and hundreds of officers of lower rank in both services have been treated by manipulative surgery; and whether he will explain why privates are denied the same expert assistance when it is offered free of charge to them or to the nation?

Mr. MACPHERSON

I have no information as to the first part of the question. In regard to the second part, the same expert assistance is given to privates as to officers, and I am sorry that my hon. Friend should suggest unfairness of treatment as between these two.

Mr. LYNCH

Is it not a fact that this question is a little more technical than appears on the surface of the questions of my hon. Friend (Mr. MacVeagh), and that it can only be thoroughly understood after a debate which entered into all the pros and cons?

Mr. SWIFT MacNEILL

Why are not the five generals and two admirals mentioned in this question tried by court-martial for the offence of getting well?

Mr. MacVEAGH

The hon. Gentleman states that he has no information with reference to these five generals and two admirals. Did I not myself give him the names of the five generals and two admirals?

Mr. MACPHERSON

Yes.

Mr. MacVEAGH

Then you have the information?

Mr. MACPHERSON

It was merely a piece of paper with five or six names upon it which the hon. Member gave me. He told me that they were cured by Mr. Barker. That was all the information I had.

Mr. MacVEAGH

I did not say that they were cured by Mr. Barker. I said they were cured by manipulative surgery.