§ 29. Mr. W. THORNEasked the President of the Board of Trade whether he has been informed that during December last the owners of quantities of New Zealand lamb were offering them c.i.f., to arrive during February, March, and April, at 6¼d. per lb.; whether during these months sew season New Zealand lamb is expected to make its top price; whether these lambs are now making 8d. per lb. and over, and are only being put on the market sparingly so as to keep up the price; whether the Government intend to become parties to an arrangement so opposed to the consumers' interests; whether he is aware that there are at least a dozen firms in Smithfield, with premises in good market positions, who would sell the Government's meat on commission and who would submit their books to a chartered accountant to verify that they had returned a true market price and who would also make the Government covering advances against ships' documents or store delivery orders; whether, as the season advances, New Zealand lambs decline in price; and, if so, whether the Government propose to wait until private individuals have reaped the profits of all the best markets and then offer their own goods in a deteriorated condition on a declining market?
Mr. RUNCIMANI can assure my hon. Friend that every effort is being made to put on the market without delay all meat which is the property of His Majesty's Government and is not required for the Allied Forces. The Government will be no party to any arrangement for keeping meat off the market for the purpose of raising prices, and if any firms through whom the Government are selling meat lend themselves to any such practice their conduct will be viewed with extreme displeasure. I shall be obliged if my hon. Friend will furnish me with precise particulars of any cases in which he knows that there has been deliberate withholding of stocks from the market. It is the 170 intention of the Government that the meat should be handled by the firms who have dealt with it in the past, and that they should dispose of it through the ordinary channels.
§ 30. Mr. THORNEasked the President of the Board of Trade whether, with respect to the relatively high price of beef and mutton fixed by the New South Wales Government compared to that of New Zealand, he is compelled to pay any price this Government fixes and take any quantity they offer; whether he will cable out to New South Wales that their prices are too high and ask for a reduction; whether, in order to steady Colonial prices, he will ascertain through the British Consul at Rio Janeiro at what price a few cargoes of frozen beef can be shipped from the Sao Paulo, Rio Grande, and other cattle-raising districts of Brazil, and also in Venezuela where there is a freezing works capable of treating 120 cattle a day; and whether he will state what arrangements he is making at Colonial freezing works to see that only sheep and cattle up to specified condition are slaughtered for export at the prices named?
Mr. RUNCIMANI have to refer my hon. Friend to my reply to his Question No. 30 on 4th May and to express my confidence in the actions of the Governments of New South Wales and New Zealand, both as regards the prices fixed for frozen meat and the precautions taken to ensure the maintenance of quality. The development of new sources of supply is engaging my attention, and I am waiting for the results of the importation of some sample shipments from Brazil. The works in Venezuela are, I understand, at present fully employed on contracts for the French Army.
§ 31. Mr. THORNEasked the President of the Board of Trade whether the three persons who have been asked to advise the Government concerning frozen meat arrangements are in each case financially interested parties; whether he proposes to consider advice from retail butchers and working men consumers; whether he will advertise in the "Meat Trades Journal" for a capable Smithfield man at a fitting remuneration to control the importation and distribution of such goods, and place upon this individual the responsibility of making the importation scheme as financially successful as possible; and, if this course be followed, will he exercise every 171 care to see that such a person is free of any interests likely to interfere with his giving his best work on the Government's behalf?
Mr. RUNCIMANI have to refer my hon. Friend to my reply to his Question 89 of 4th May, and to add that I am fully satisfied that such business interests as any of the gentlemen who have been advising the Government may have, in no way preclude them from giving independent advice. The regulations for the disposal of meat sold on behalf of the Government have been drawn up after consultation with representative retail butchers, and seem to me to be satisfactory.
§ 34. Mr. HOUSTONasked the President of the Board of Trade whether he is aware that by Order in Council dated 29th April, 1915, and by subsequent notice served by the Board of Trade upon owners of refrigerated steamers, all the refrigerated steamers engaged in the River Plate trade, with the exception of steamers owned by one company, have been requisitioned by the Government for the conveyance of meat; whether he is aware that, notwithstanding this Order in Council and Board of Trade requisition, the firm of William Mathwin and Son, coal exporters and agents to the Admiralty at Cardiff, acting under instructions from the Director of Transports, on 31st May requisitioned on behalf of the Admiralty one of these refrigerated steamers for Admiralty coal service, notwithstanding the number of tramp steamers suitable for coal service which have escaped requisition by the Admiralty; whether he is aware of the increase in the price of meat charged to the British public and of the necessity of every refrigerated steamer being employed in the carriage of meat for supplying the British and French Armies and the British public; whether he some time ago informed the Director of Transports that the Board of Trade had requisitioned the refrigerated steamers engaged in the River Plate trade for the carriage of meat, giving the names of the steamers; whether the Director of Transports, with abundance of tramp steamers available for carrying coal, is entitled to requisition for coal service a steamer already requisitioned by the Board of Trade for the carriage of meat; and whether the Director of Transports is entitled to override an Order in Council and the acts of 172 the President of the Board of Trade and thereby ignore the food requirements of the British Army and the British public?
Mr. RUNCIMANI understand that the requisitioning of the vessel referred to was due to an oversight, and was cancelled as soon as this was discovered, namely, on the second day after the requisition was forwarded to the owners.
§ Mr. HOUSTONIs the right hon. Gentleman not aware that it was only cancelled when I called attention to the outrageous mistake made by the Admiralty agent, and can the right hon. Gentleman tell me whether the powers delegated by the Admiralty to Messrs. Mathwin and Son were in turn delegated by them to the office boy, and will he make representation in the proper quarter that such arbitrary powers as requisitioning ships shall only be put into the hands of those who know something about ships?
Mr. RUNCIMANThe whole subject of requisitioning by the Admiralty is a subject on which questions should be put to the Secretary to the Admiralty or the First Lord. I cannot answer for them.
§ 36. Mr. HOUSTONasked the President of the Board of Trade whether the Nelson, Line steamers are almost entirely insulated throughout and carry large quantities of meat under contract from the River Plate to London; whether he is aware that this contract was made some years before the War, and that meat has been, and is still being, carried under it at the original rate of freight without any addition or increase; whether several other insulated steamers are also carrying meat at pre-War rates, or very little advance on the same; and whether, seeing there has been practically no advance in freight on the great bulk of the meat carried by these vessels, he can state why the present retail price of meat is so high, and why such a considerable advance has taken place since August last in the price of meat charged to the British public?
Mr. RUNCIMANAs the hon. Gentleman knows, there has been a large demand for frozen meat for the use of the British and French Armies. The consumption of meat by men under arms is much larger than the consumption by the same men in peace times, and the requirements of the French Government are almost entirely new, refrigerated meat having been consumed only to a very small extent in 173 France before the War. The pressure of these demands on the available supplies at a time when there is a shortage (due to War losses) of vessels equipped for the conveyance of meat from overseas has been the main cause of the high prices of meat which have prevailed since the outbreak of the War.
§ Mr. HOUSTONIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that the whole of the cold storage in Liverpool is filled with meat, thus causing great delay to those steamers which have arrived, and are arriving with meat, and is the whole of this great supply of meat required for the Army?
Mr. RUNCIMANI was not aware of the condition of the stores of Liverpool and I cannot say how much of the meat in those stores is required for the Army, but the Army requirements are very large and certainly must be met.