§ 80 and 82. Mr. O'DONNELLasked the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) whether he will explain why, in making Grants to Scotland and Ireland equivalent to those proposed for England, the relative populations of the three countries have not been adopted as a basis of calculation, seeing that the Goschen ratio of 80, 11, and 9 has long been discarded and that the population ratio would give the figures 79¾ for England, 10½ for Scotland, and 9¾ for Ireland; and (2) why, if England and Scotland already get considerably more from the Imperial Exchequer for education than Ireland, he proposes to give further Exchequer Grants of £3,900,000 to England, £536,250 to Scotland, and only £112,500 to Ireland, whereas Ireland's share, calculated even on the Goschen basis, would be £438,750, and on the population basis would be £476,800?
§ 81. Mr. GINNELLasked what the Chancellor of the Exchequer means by his proposal to eliminate the amounts given in relief of rates in Ireland for education and police; whether the process is by way of set off or deduction; what would the figures for Ireland be on the system hitherto in operation before that process and after it; whether he calculates that the direct relief of rates, which is to average 9d. in the £ in England, will be experienced in Ireland also; and, if not, what is the estimated net direct relief of rates in Ireland in the aggregate and in the £ due to the new proposals?
§ Mr. LLOYD GEORGEI would refer the hon. Member to the explanation which I gave in my Financial Statement of the reasons for adopting the proposed method of calculating the share of Ireland in the new Grants. For the rest, I can only refer to the answer which I gave to the hon. Member for North Meath on Monday last.
§ Mr. GINNELLWill the right hon. Gentleman say whether the relief of rates in Ireland will be ninepence in the pound, as in this country?
§ Mr. LLOYD GEORGEI have not made a calculation so far as Ireland is concerned. The money will be paid over to the Irish Government, and the question of its distribution will be a matter entirely for them to deal with.
§ Mr. GINNELLWill the relief to the Irish rates in this current year be the same in Ireland as it is in this country?
§ Mr. LLOYD GEORGEThe basis of calculation, as the hon. Member well knows, is purely rateable as far as Ireland is concerned. I do not know what the amount will run to in Ireland. The hon. Member knows the figures of the Irish rates, and he will find them in the Blue Book, therefore he can easily make out the calculation for himself.
§ Mr. GINNELLWill the right hon. Gentleman—
§ Mr. SPEAKERMr. Austen Chamberlain.
§ Mr. GINNELLMr. Speaker—
§ Mr. SPEAKERI have called upon the right hon. Gentleman the Member for East Worcestershire.
§ Mr. GINNELLI had not clone.
§ Mr. SPEAKERI had not done either.
§ Mr. AUSTEN CHAMBERLAINIn connection with this subject, will the right hon. Gentleman supply us not merely with a statement of the amount of money which is to go to Ireland out of the new taxation, but the amount that he calculates he will receive from Ireland?
§ Mr. LLOYD GEORGEYes; I propose to give the figures with regard to that.
§ Mr. GINNELLWill the right hon. Gentleman say now whether there will be any relief to the rates in Ireland resulting from his Budget this year, and, if so, on what information does he base his opinion?
§ Mr. LLOYD GEORGEThe amount to be paid to Ireland will be calculated upon the basis of four months, exactly as it is in this country. The allocation of that Grant depends upon the provisional arrangement that will be made.