§ 35. Mr. ORMSBY-GOREasked the Home Secretary with reference to the Definition Clause, page 33, of the Established Church (Wales) Bill, whether the expression, line 14, precincts of the cathedral church includes the lawns and burial ground, plantation of trees, and monuments round the cathedral church; whether the cathedral yard at St. Asaph and the monument in it erected to the memory of Bishop Morgan, who gave the Welsh the Bible in their own tongue, will be transferred to the Representative Church Body; or whether, in view of the fact that the cathedral yard is still used for burials, it will be transferred to the local burial authority?
§ Mr. McKENNAIt is impossible to say without an examination of detailed plans and a full knowledge of the actual facts of the case whether the lawns, burial ground, plantation of trees, monuments, the cathedral yard, and Bishop Morgan's monument respectively, are as a matter of fact part of the precincts of the cathedral at St. Asaph. If, in fact, they are, they will, under the provisions of the Bill, be transferred to the Representative Body.
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREDo I understand the right hon. Gentleman to say that if the cathedral yard is regarded by a Court of Law as a public burial ground that then it will be transferred, and all the monuments in it, to the local burial authority?
§ Mr. McKENNAI have stated exactly the opposite. [HON. MEMBERS "No!"] I stated in my answer, "If, in fact, they are, they will under the provisions of the Bill be transferred to the Representative Body."
§ Mr. ORMSBY-GOREIs it not desirable to make that perfectly clear in the Definition Clause of the Bill?
§ Mr. McKENNAThat is exactly what the Definition Clause does now.
§ 36. Mr. ORMSBY-GOREasked the Home Secretary whether the expression ecclesiastical residence, as defined in the Established Church (Wales) Bill, includes all private grounds, plantations, carriage drives, lawns, etc., in addition to the offices belonging to such residence?
§ Mr. McKENNAI would refer the hon. Member to the definitions of "ecclesiastical 1852 residence" and "house," respectively in Clause 38 of the Bill. The latter includes any garden appurtenant to or usually occupied with the house, and the question whether any private grounds, plantations, carriage drives, lawns, etc., belonging to ecclesiastical residences in Wales are included in this definition will depend on the facts in each particular case.
§ 37. Mr. ORMSBY-GOREasked the Home Secretary what definition of the term laity of the Church in Wales, as used in Clause 13 of the Established Church (Wales) Bill, he is prepared to insert so as to guard against persons who are not bonâ fide adherents of the Church in Wales from claiming to be laity of the Church in Wales for the purposes of this Clause?
§ Mr. McKENNAI offered when the Bill was first in Committee to insert any definition of "laity" which might be agreed upon by the representatives of the Church. No such definition was proposed to me.
§ Mr. JAMES HOPEasked a question, which was inaudible in the Reporters' Gallery.
§ Mr. McKENNAIf the hon. Member will put his question on the Paper I shall be glad to answer it.
§ Mr. W. F. ROCHIs it not clear that the hon. Member for Central Sheffield (Mr. Hope) would be a Nonconformist, and is, therefore, not eligible?
§ Mr. McKENNAI am not exactly aware what the hon. Member's faith may be, but if he will put a question on the Paper I shall be happy to consider it.