HC Deb 02 April 1914 vol 60 cc1359-64
Mr. BONAR LAW

May I ask whether the Government have any further telegrams to communicate to the House from General Paget in regard to the resignations?

Mr. McKENNA

Yes. As promised by the Prime Minister, I have here all the telegrams which were sent, but some of which were not included in the original Papers because they were not regarded as relevant. The first is: Sent midnight, 20th March, 1914. From Secretary of State for War to General Sir Arthur Paget. Your second telegram just received. It is not clear whether any officers of 4th Hussars implicated or whether you have any reason to complain of officers commanding that regiment. Please reply at once. From General Sir Arthur Paget to the Secretary of State for War. Received 6 o'clock 21st. March, 1914. All officers 4th Hussars doing duty are implicated. Believe colonel is present, but will wire again. From General Sir Arthur Paget to Secretary of State for War. Received 10.37 a.m., 21st March, 1914. Am going myself this morning to the Curragh and will send a full telegraphic report later. Colonel 4th Hussars is implicated. From Secretary of State to General Sir Arthur Paget, Dublin. Sent 11.30 a.m., 21st March, 1914. You should instruct colonel, 4th Hussars, to report himself, as in case of the others, to the Adjutant-General, War Office. From Sir Arthur Paget, Dublin, to Adjutant-General. Received Saturday evening, 21st March, 1914. Hogg has withdrawn his resignation.

Mr. CHAMBERLAIN

In the telegrams which the right hon. Gentleman read from Sir Arthur Paget dated the 21st (Saturday) is one in which he states he is proceeding himself to the Curragh and will send a full telegraphic report. Was that telegraphic report ever received here and, if so, will that be read?

Mr. McKENNA

All the reports received I have now read. Those which I now read for the first time were not included in the White Paper because they were not regarded as relevant.

Mr. CHAMBERLAIN

Are we to understand that the promised telegraphic report of the result of Sir Arthur Paget's visit to the Curragh was never sent?

Mr. McKENNA

The right hon. Gentleman would perhaps put a question on the Paper. I shall have to consult the documents.

Mr. J. WARD

Arising out of that answer, does not the right hon. Gentleman think that, after all, it is impossible to suppress full discussion on this subject, and had he not better publish the whole-of these Papers?

Mr. McKENNA

I have explained to the House that that has been done. All the telegraphic messages have been published, and there is nothing further to add.

Mr. J. WARD

Arising out of the further reply of the right hon. Gentleman, is it not a fact, that a similar statement to what he has now made was made before, yet there were other telegrams which were not published?

Mr. McKENNA

No, Sir; my hon. Friend must not misunderstand the point. The statement was made previously that all relevant telegrams had been published. I think anyone who studies the telegrams which I have now read, and which include all the telegraphic matter which has passed, will say that the later telegrams now published are not really relevant to any question which was in issue at the time.

Mr. BONAR LAW

May I ask whether the action of the colonel of the 4th Hussars was not relevant?

Mr. McKENNA

No, Sir. It was not because, as the right hon. Gentleman will see by the last telegram, "Hogg"—that was the colonel of the 4th Hussars—"has withdrawn."

Colonel YATE

Is it usual and customary for the Secretary of State, on matters of discipline, to telegraph direct to the General Officer Commanding and not through the Adjutant-General?

Mr. McKENNA

I shall have to have notice of that question.

Mr. AMERY

Will the right hon. Gentleman explain how it is that these telegrams do not yet make it clear how the dismissal of the officer commanding the 16th Lancers—not the 4th Hussars—was ordered by the War Office on the assumption that he had been implicated?

Mr. McKENNA

I think if the hon. Gentleman examines the original Army Paper, he will see that on the evening of the 20th March, 7 o'clock, a telegram was sent— Officer commanding the 5th Lancers states all officers except two, and one doubtful, are resigning their commissions to-day. I much fear same conditions in 16th Lancers. Fear men will refuse to move. The next telegram, received at 11.35, goes on to say:— Regret, to report brigadier and fifty-seven officers, 3rd Cavalry Brigade, prefer dismissal if ordered North. The number fifty-seven shows that it must include all the three regiments; but inasmuch as the 4th Hussars had not been mentioned, a specific question was, directed as to the 4th Hussars. I have read the series of telegrams which relate to that regiment. It is quite clear, and anybody must so infer from the number given, that both the 5th and 16th Lancers were involved.

Mr. BONAR LAW

Does the right hon. Gentleman not see, from what he has just read out, that all the information the War Office had to act upon when they dismissed the colonel of the 16th Lancers from his command and appointed his successor was that General Paget said he feared they would take the same step, and does not he know that as the fifty-seven officers mentioned did not include all the officers, it was absolutely impossible for them to be sure that the colonel of the 16th Lancers was included?

Mr. McKENNA

From the information at their disposal the War Office concluded—and rightly concluded—that the officers concerned amongst the fifty-seven names included the colonels of the 5th and 16th Lancers.

Mr. BONAR LAW

It is quite true that the assumption of the War Office was correct; but does the right hon. Gentleman deny that if that is all the information they possessed, they actually dismissed this. officer from his command when they had no information that he had done anything deserving dismissal?

Mr. AMERY

May I ask if the right lion. Gentleman is aware that there were sixty-five officers in the brigade, and could the War Office have been aware without knowing how many—

Mr. SPEAKER

The hon. Member had better put down a question.

Lord ROBERT CECIL

May I ask whether the Government will now pro- duce, not only all the telegraphic messages, but all the written dispatches and all communications that have passed?

Mr. McKENNA

There are no written communications, or dispatches, or telegraphic messages relating to the matters in question which have not been produced.

Sir R. POLE-CAREW

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman why the original instructions given to General Paget are consistently refused to this House, and by whom they were given?

Mr. McKENNA

That question has been answered twice in the course of this afternoon. The instructions were given by the Secretary of State on the responsibility of the Cabinet, and they have been published.

Sir R. POLE-CAREW

The original instructions?

Mr. McKENNA

Yes; the instructions of 14th March.

Mr. SPEAKER

There must be a limit now to this cross-examination.

70. Lord C. BERESFORD

asked the First Lord of the Admiralty whether any naval officer was sent from the War Staff at the Admiralty to be attached to the staff of General Sir Arthur Paget; whether cables were laid and connections made with the existing telegraph and telephone system from a man-of-war at Kingston connected with the military Commander-in-Chief's headquarters; and, if so, with what object?

Mr. CHURCHILL

A naval officer has for some time been attached to the General Staff of the War Office, and this officer was, on the 20th of last month, attached temporarily to Sir Arthur Paget's staff, at his request, to advise on any question connected with the embarkation or disembarkation of troops. Nothing is known at the Admiralty of the matters mentioned in the second part of the question.

92. Mr. GEORGE TERRELL

asked whether Sir Arthur Paget was summoned to London on any day in March, prior to the 20th March, to receive instructions as to the conduct of military matters in Ulster; and whether, in connection with the instructions which were given to him, the protection of military stores was a matter of secondary importance?

Mr. McKENNA

Sir Arthur Paget was summoned to London for a general consultation on the state of affairs in Ireland. No verbal instructions on the matters referred to were given to him which were inconsistent with or went beyond the written instructions of the 14th March. The answer to the last part of the question is in the negative.

93. Mr. GEORGE TERRELL

asked whether, in connection with the summoning of Sir Arthur Paget to London, and in connection with the instructions which were given to him, the ex-Secretary of State for War was acting on his own responsibility or on the authority of the Cabinet, or with the knowledge and assent of any and, if any, of which of the Members thereof?

Mr. McKENNA

The Cabinet were responsible for the instructions which were given to Sir Arthur Paget on the 14th of March.

96. Lord C. BERESFORD

asked the Under-Secretary of State for War if he will lay upon the Table of the House General Sir Arthur Paget's reply to the letter from the Army Council dated 14th March, 1914?

Mr. McKENNA

Yes, Sir. [See Written I Answers this date. ]