HC Deb 30 June 1913 vol 54 cc1569-75

Resolution reported, That it is expedient, for the purposes of any Act of the present Session to amend the provision for the Government of Ireland,—

To authorise the payment in each year out of the Consolidated Fund of the United Kingdom into the Irish Exchequer or to any body or person in the stead of the Irish Exchequer—

  1. (a) of a fixed sum based on the cost at the time of the passing of the said Act of the branches of Government to be administered thereunder by the Irish Government and, in the case of the future transfer of any other branches of government to the Irish Government, of further sums based on the saving to the Exchequer of the United Kingdom resulting from the transfer; the amount of the said fixed sum and any such further sums to be determined in manner provided by the said Act, with power to make payments on account of those sums pending that determination; and
  2. 1570
  3. (b)of a sum of five hundred thousand pounds, diminishing in each year after the third year of payment by the sum of fifty thousand pounds until it is reduced to the sum of two hundred thousand pounds; and
  4. (c) of sums equal to the proceeds of any taxes imposed by the Irish Parliament in pursuance of the powers given by the said Act, the amount of those proceeds to be determined in manner provided by the said Act:

And to authorise such Customs Duties to be charged on articles brought into Great Britain from Ireland or into Ireland from Great Britain, and such alterations of drawbacks or allowances to be made in respect of those articles, as may be provided for by the said Act, in cases where any Customs or Excise Duty levied in Great Britain is levied at a different rate from that at which the duty is levied in Ireland, or where any Customs or Excise Duty is levied in Great Britain and not levied in Ireland, or levied in Ireland and not levied in Great Britain:

And to authorise the payment out of the Consolidated Fund or out of moneys provided by Parliament of any salaries, pensions, superannuation allowances, gratuities, or compensation, for the payment of which to or on behalf of any judges or Irish officers, or officers or constables of the Royal Irish Constabulary or of the Dublin Metropolitan Police force, provision may be made in pursuance of the said Act, and also of any sums for the payment of which out of the Consolidated Fund or out of moneys provided by Parliament provision may be made by the said Act in the event of the failure of the Irish Government to make any such payment."

Mr. SPEAKER proceeded, pursuant to the Order of the House of the 23rd June, to put forthwith the Question, "That this House doth agree with the Committee in the said Resolution."

The House divided: Ayes, 304; Noes, 187.

O'Dowd, John Richardson, Thomas (Whitehaven) Trevelyan, Charles Philips
O'Grady, James Roberts, Charles H. (Lincoln) Ure, Rt. Hon. Alexander
O'Kelly, Edward P. (Wicklow, W.) Roberts, G. H. (Norwich) Verney, Sir Harry
O'Kelly, James (Roscommon, N.) Roberts, Sir J. H. (Denbigh!) Wadsworth, John
O'Malley, William Robertson, Sir G. Scott (Bradford) Walters, Sir John Tudor
O'Neill, Dr. Charles (Armagh, S.) Robertson, J. M. (Tyneside) Walton, Sir Joseph
O'Shaughnessy P. J, Robinson, Sidney Ward, John (Stoke upon-Trent)
O'Shee, James John Roch, Walter F. (Pembroke) Ward, W. Dudley (Southampton)
O'Sullivan, Timothy Roche, Augustine (Louth) Wardle, George J.
Outhwalte, R. L. Roe, Sir Thomas Warner, Sir Thomas Courtenay
Palmer, Godfrey Mark Rowlands, James Wason, Rt. Hon. E. (Clackmannan)
Parker, James (Halifax) Rowntree, Arnold Wason, John Cathcart (Orkney)
Pearce, Robert (Staffs, Leek) Runciman, Rt. Hon. Walter Watt, Henry A.
Pearce, William (Limehouse) Samuel, Rt. Hon. H. L. (Cleveland) Webb, H.
Pease, Rt. Hon. Joseph A. (Rotherham) Samuel, J. (Stockton) White, J. Dundas (Glasgow, Tradeston)
Philipps, Colonel Ivor (Southampton) Scanlan, Thomas White, Sir Luke (Yorks, E.R.)
Phillips. John (Longford, S.) Schwann, Rt. Hon. Sir C. E. White, Patrick (Meath, North)
Pirie, Duncan V. Scott, A. MacCallum (Glas., Bridgeton) Whitehouse, John Howard
Pointer, Joseph Seely, Colonel Rt. Hon. J. E. B. Whittaker, Rt. Hon. Sir Thomas P.
Pollard, Sir George H. Sheehy, David Whyte, Alexander F.
Ponsonby, Arthur A. W. H. Sherwell, Arthur James Wiles, Thomas
Price, C. E. (Edinburgh, Central) Simon, Rt. Hon. Sir Allsebrook Williams, J. (Glamorgan)
Price, Sir Robert J. (Norfolk, E.) Smith, Albert (Lanes., Clitheroe) Williamson, Sir Archibald
Priestley, Sir Arthur (Grantham) Smith, H. B. Lees (Northampton) Wilson, John (Durham, Mid)
Primrose, Hon. Nell James Smyth, Thomas F. (Leitrim, S.) Wilson, Rt. Hon. J. W. (Worcs., N.)
Pringle, William M. R. Snowden, Philip Wilson, W. T. (Westhoughton)
Radford, G. H. Soames, Arthur Wellesley Winfrey, Richard
Raphael, Sir Herbert H. Spicer, Rt. Hon. Sir Albert Wing, Thomas
Rea, Rt. Hon. Russell, (South Shields) Strauss, Edward A. (Southwark, West) Wood, Rt. Hon. T. McKinnon (Glas.)
Rea, Walter Russell (Scarborough) Sutherland, John E. Young, William (Perthshire, E.)
Reddy, Michael Taylor, John W. (Durham) Yoxall, Sir James Henry
Redmond, John E. (Waterford) Tennant, Harold John
Redmond, William (Clare, E.) Thome, G. R. (Wolverhampton) TELLERS FOR THE AYES.—Mr.
Redmond, William Archer (Tyrone, E.) Toulmin, Sir George Illingworth and Mr. Gulland.
Rendall, Athelstan
Division No. 129.] AYES. [7.15 p.m.
Abraham, William (Dublin, Harbour) Doris, William Jowett, F. W.
Acland, Francis Dyke Duffy, William Joyce, Michael
Adamson, William Duncan, J. Hastings (York. Otley) Keating, Matthew
Addison, Dr. C. Edwards, Clement (Glamorgan, E.) Kellaway, Frederick George
Adkins, Sir W. Ryland D. Edwards, Sir Francis (Radnor) Kelly, Edward
Allen, Arthur A. (Dumbartonshire) Edwards, John Hugh (Glamorgan, Mid) Kennedy, Vincent Paul
Allen, Rt. Hon. Charles P. (Stroud) Elverston, Sir Harold Kilbride, Denis
Asquith, Rt. Hon. Herbert Henry Esmonde, Dr. John (Tipperary, N.) King, J.
Baker, H. T. (Accrington) Esmonde. Sir Thomas (Wexford, N.) Lambert, Rt. Hon. G. (Devon,S.Molton)
Baker, Joseph A. (Finsbury, E.) Essex, Sir Richard Walter Lambert, Richard (Wilts, Cricklade)
Balfour, Sir Robert (Lanark) Esslemont, George Birnie Lardner, James C. R.
Baring. Sir Godfrey (Barnstaple) Falconer, James Law, Hugh A. (Donegal, W.)
Barlow, Sir John Emmott (Somerset) Fenwick, Rt. Hon. Charles Lawson, Sir W. (Cumb'rld.Cockerm'th)
Barnes, G. N. Ferens, Rt. Hon. Thomas Robinson Leach, Charles
Bare an, Rowland Hurst (Leeds, N.) Ffrench, Peter Levy, Sir Maurice
Barton, William Field, William Lewis, Rt. Hon. John Herbert
Beale, Sir William Phipson Fitzgibbon, John Lough, Rt. Hon. Thomas
Beauchamp, Sir Edward Flavin, Michael Joseph Low, Sir Frederick (Norwich)
Beck, Arthur Cecil Furness, Sir Stephen Wilson Lundon, Thomas
Benn, W. W. (T. H'mts, St. George) Gladstone, W. G. C. Lyell. Charles Henry
Bethell, Sir J. H. Glanville, H. J. Lynch, A. A.
Birrell, Rt. Hon. Augustine Goddard, Sir Daniel Ford Macdonald, J. Ramsay (Leicester)
Black, Arthur W. Goldstone, Frank Macdonald, J. M. (Falkirk Burghs)
Boland, John Pius Greenwood, Granville G. (Peterborough) MacGhee, Richard
Booth, Frederick Handel Greenwood, Hamar (Sunderland) Maclean, Donald
Bowerman, C. W. Griffith, Ellis J. Macnamara, Rt. Hon. Dr. T. J.
Boyle, Daniel (Mayo, North) Guest, Hon. Major C. H. C. (Pembroke) MacNeill, J. G. Swift (Donegal. South)
Brady, Patrick Joseph Guest, Hon. Frederick E. (Dorset, E.) Macpherson, James Ian
Brocklehurst, W. B. Gwynn, Stephen Lucius (Galway) MacVeagh, Jeremiah
Brunner, John F. L. Hackett, John M'Kean, John
Bryce, J. Annan Hall, Frederick (Normanton) McKenna, Rt. Hon. Reginald
Buckmaster, Stanley O. Harcourt, Rt. Hon. Lewis (Rossendale) M'Laren, H. D. (Leics.)
Burke, E. Haviland- Harcourt, Robert V. (Montrose) M'Laren, Hon.F.W.S. (Lines.,Spalding)
Burns, Rt. Hon. John Hardie, J. Keir M'Micking, Major Gilbert
Burt, Rt. Hon. Thomas Harmsworth, Cecil (Luton, Beds) Manfield, Harry
Baxton, Noel (Norfolk, North) Harmsworth, R. L. (Caithness-shire) Markham, Sir Arthur Basil
Buxtcn, Rt. Hon. Sydney C. (Poplar) Harvey, T. E. (Leeds, West) Marshall, Arthur Harold
Carr-Gomm, H. W. Harvey, W. E. (Derbyshire, N.E.) Mason, David M. (Coventry)
Cawley, Sir Frederick (Prestwich) Haslam, Lewis (Monmouth) Masterman, Rt. Hon. C. F. G.
Cawley, Harold T. (Heywood) Havelock-Allan, Sir Henry Meagher, Michael
Chancellor, Henry George Hayden, John Patrick Meehan, Francis E. (Leitrim, N.)
Chapple. Dr. William Allen Hayward, John Evan Meehan, Patrick J. (Queen's Co., Leix)
Churchill, Rt. Hon. Winston S. Hazleton, Richard Millar, James Duncan
Clancy, John Joseph Helme, Sir Norval Watson Molloy, Michael
Clough, William Hemmerde, Edward George Molteno, Percy Alport
Collins, G. P. (Greenock) Henderson, Arthur (Durham) Mond, Rt. Hon. Sir Alfred
Collins, Sir Stephen (Lambeth) Henderson, J. M. (Aberdeen, W.) Money, L. G. Chiozza
Compton-Rickett, Rt. Hon. Sir J. Henry, Sir Charles Montagu, Hon. E. S.
Condon, Thomas Joseph Herbert, General Sir Ivor (Mon., S.) Mooney, John J.
Cornwall, Sir Edwin A. Hewart, Gordon Morgan, George Hay
Cotton, William Francis Higham, John Sharp Morrell, Philip
Cowan, W. H. Hinds, John Morison, Hector
Craig, Herbert J. (Tynemouth) Hobhouse, Rt. Hon. Charles E. Morton, Alpheus Cleophas
Crooks, William Hogge, James Myles Muidoon, John
Crumley, Patrick Holmes, Daniel Turner Munro, R.
Cullinan, John Home, Charles Silvester (Ipswich) Munro-Ferguson, Rt. Hon. R. C.
Dalziel, Rt. Hon. Sir J. H. (Kirkcaldy) Howard, Hon. Geoffrey Murphy, Martin J.
Davies, Ellis William (Eifion) Hudson, Walter Murray, Captain Hon. Arthur C.
Davies, Timothy (Lines., Louth) Hughes, S. L, Nannetti, Joseph P.
Davies, Sir W. Howell (Bristol, S.) Isaacs, Rt. Hon. Sir Rufus Neilson, Francis
Davies, M. Vaughan- (Cardigan) Jardine, Sir J. (Roxburgh) Nicholson, Sir Charles N. (Doncaster)
Dawes, J. A. John, Edward Thomas Nolan, Joseph
Delany, William Jones, Rt.Hon. Sir D.Brynmor (Swansea) Norton, Captain Cecil W.
Denman, Rt. Hon. Richard Jones, Edgar (Merthyr Tydvll) O'Brien, Patrick (Kilkenny)
Devlin, Joseph Jones, H. Haydn (Merioneth) O'Connor, John (Kildare, N.)
Dickinson, W. H. Jones, J. Towyn (Carmarthen, East) O'Connor, T. P. (Liverpool)
Dillon, John Jones, William (Carnarvonshire) O'Doherty, Philip
Donelan, Captain A. Jones, W. S. Glyn- (Stepney) O'Donneli, Thomas
Amery, L. C. M. S. Croft, H. P. Hunt, Rowland
Anson, Rt. Hon. Sir William R. Dalrymple, Viscount Hunter, Sir Charles Rodk.
Anstruther-Gray, Major William Dalziel, Davison (Brixton) Ingleby, Holcombe
Archer-Shee, Major M. Denison-Pender, J. C. Jardine, Ernest (Somerset, E.)
Ashley, Wilfrid W. Denniss, E. R. B. Joynson-Hicks, William
Astor, Waldorf Dickson, Rt. Hon. C. Scott Kerry, Earl of
Baird, John Lawrence Duke, Henry Edward Kinloch-Cooke, Sir Clement
Baker, Sir Randolf L. (Dorset, N.) Duncannon, Viscount Knight, Captain Eric Ayshford
Baldwin, Stanley Eyres-Monsell, Bolton M. Larmor, Sir J.
Banbury, Sir Frederick George Faber, Capt. W. V. (Hants, W.) Law son, Hon. H. (T. H'mts, Mile End)
Baring, Maj. Hon. Guy V. (Winchester) Fell, Arthur Lewisham, Viscount
Barnston, Harry Finlay, Rt. Hon. Sir Robert Lloyd, George Ambrose (Stafford, W.)
Bathurst, Hon. A. B. (Glouc, E.) Fisher, Rt. Hon. W. Hayes Lloyd, George Butler (Shrewsbury)
Bathurst, Charles (Wilts, Wilton) Fletcher, John Samuel Lockwood, Rt. Hon. Lt.-Col. A. R.
Beach, Hon. Michael Hugh Hicks Forster, Henry William Lowe, Sir F. W. (Birm., Edgbaston)
Beckett, Hon. Gervase Gardner, Ernest Lyttelton, Hon. J. C. (Droitwich)
Benn, Arthur Shirley (Plymouth) Gastrell, Major W. Houghton Mackinder, Halford J.
Benn, Ion Hamilton (Greenwich) Glimour, Captain John McNeill, Ronald (Kent, St. Augustine)
Bentinck, Lord H. Cavendish Glazebrook, Capt. Philip K. Magnus, Sir Philip
Bigland, Alfred Goldsmith, Frank Mason, James F. (Windsor)
Bird, A. Gordon, Hon. John Edward (Brighton) Middlemore, John Throgmorton
Blair, Reginald Grant, J. A. Mildmay, Francis Bingham
Boles, Lieut.-Col. Denis Fortescue Greene, Walter Raymond Mills, Hon. Charles Thomas
Boyle, William (Norfolk, Mid) Gretton, Gohn Morrison-Bell, Capt. E. F. (Ashburton)
Boyton, James Guinness, Hon.W.E. (Bury,S.Edmunds) Morrison-Bell, Major A. C. (Honiton)
Bridgeman, W. Clive Gwynne, R. S. (Sussex, Eastbourne) Mount, William Arthur
Bull, Sir William James Haddock, George Bahr Neville, Reginald J. N.
Burdett-Coutts, W. Hall, Frederick (Dulwich) Newdegate, F. A.
Burn, Colonel C. R. Hall, Marshall (E. Toxteth) Newman, John R. P.
Butcher, John George Hambro, Angus Valdemar Newton, Harry Kotingham
Campbell, Captain Duncan F. (Ayr, N.) Hamersley, Alfred St. George Nicholson, William G. (Petersfield)
Campion, W. R. Hamilton, C. G. C. (Ches., Altrincham) Nield, Herbert
Carlile, Sir Edward Hildred Hamilton, Lord C. J. (Kensington, S.) Norton-Griffithe, J.
Cassel, Felix Harris, Henry Percy Orde-Powlett, Hon. W. G. A.
Cator, John Helmsley, Viscount Ormsby-Gore, Hon. William
Cautley, Henry Strother Henderson, Major H, (Berkshire) Paget, Almertc Hugh
Cave, George Hewins, William Albert Samuel Parker, Sir Gilbert (Gravesend)
Cecil, Lord Hugh (Oxford Univ.) Hills, John Waller Pease, Herbert Pike (Darlington)
Cecil, Lord R. (Herts, Hitchln) Hill-Wood, Samuel Peel, Lieut.-Colonel R. F.
Chalonel, Colonel R. G. W. Hoare, S. J. G. Perkins, Walter Frank
Clive, Captain, Percy Archer Hohler, Gerald Fltzroy Pollock, Ernest Murray
Coates, Major Sir Edward Feetham Hope, Harry (Bute) Pretyman, Ernest George
Craig, Norman (Kent, Thanet) Hope, James Fitzalan (Sheffield) Pryce-Jones, Colonel E.
Cralk, Sir Henry Horne, E. (Surrey, Guildford) Quilter, Sir W. E. C.
Crichton-Stuart, Lord Ninlan Houston, Robert Paterson Randies, Sir John S.
Cripps, Sir Charles Alfred Hume-Williams, William Ellis Rawilnson, John Frederick Peel

Bill read a second time, and committed.

Rawson, Colonel Richard H. Stanley, Hon. G. F. (Preston) Warde, Col. C. E. (Kent, Mid)
Roberts, S. (Sheffield, Ecclesall) Starkey, John Ralph Weston, Colonel J. W.
Ronaldshay, Earl of Steel-Maitland, A. D. Wheler, Granville C. H.
Rothschild, Lionel de Stewart, Gershom White, Major G. D. (Lanes., Southport)
Royds, Edmund Strauss, Arthur (Paddington, North) Williams, Col. R. (Dorset, W.)
Rutherford, Watson (L'pool, W. Derby) Swift, Rigby Willoughby, Major Hon. Claud
Salter, Arthur Clavell Sykes, Allan John (Ches., Knutsford) Wilson, A. Stanley (Yorks, E.R.)
Samuel, Sir Harry (Norwood) Sykes, Sir Mark (Hull, Central) Winterton, Earl
Samuel, Samuel (Wandswortn) Terrell, George (Wilts, N.W.) Wolmer, Viscount
Sanderson, Lancelot Terrell, Henry (Gloucester) Wood, Hon. E. F. L. (Yorks, Ripon)
Sandys, G. J. Thynne, Lord A. Wood, John (Stalybridge)
Sassoon, Sir Philip Touche, George Alexander Worthington-Evans, L.
Scott, Sir S. (Marylebone, W.) Tyron, Captain George Clement Yate, Colonel C. E.
Smith, Rt. Hon. F. E. (L'p'l, Walton) Valentia, Viscount Younger, Sir George
Smith, Harold (Warrington) Walker, Col. William Hall
Spear, Sir John Ward Walrond, Hon. Lionel TELLERS FOR THE NOES.—Lord
Stanley, Hon. Arthur (Ormskirk) Ward, A. S. (Herts, Watford) Edmund Talbot and Mr. Sanders.