§ 20. Sir J. LONSDALEasked the Chief Secretary whether the Local Government Board have advised any county councils in Ireland to make arrangements with the Women's National Health Association for the provision of sanatoria; if the Board have formed any opinion as to the advisability of county councils undertaking themselves the work of initiation and management of the sanatorium Grants, and if that opinion will be communicated to the county councils; and if he will guarantee that counties working independently of the association will not suffer as regards their share of the total Grant in comparison with the counties who have decided to hand over their statutory responsibilities to an irresponsible association?
§ Mr. SWIFT MacNEILLIs it within the right and scope of county councils in Ireland to decide for themselves in what manner they will administer sanatorium benefit in their counties, whether by the establishment of local sanatoria or by sending their patients to a central sanatorium; and have the Local Government any right, unless they are asked, to give any advice whatever on the matter?
§ Mr. BIRRELLI should like to have notice. In answer to the question on the Paper, the Local Government Board have advised all county councils to make immediate arrangements for the treatment of consumptives belonging to their respective counties, and they have not interfered in any way with the discretion vested in county councils of providing sanatoria for the inhabitants of their counties either by establishing such institutions themselves or by entering into agreements with persons having the management of such institutions. The same principles of distribution will be observed whether a county council acts in concert with or independently of the Women's National Health Association.
§ Sir J. LONSDALEIs it within the knowledge of the right hon. Gentleman that the Local Government Board have advised any county councils in Ireland to make arrangements with the Women's Health Association?
§ 21. Sir J. LONSDALEasked if the Local Government Board have satisfied themselves as to who is legally liable for the maintenance and upkeep of the sanatorium buildings provided by the Women's National Health Association in the event of the weekly contributions on behalf of patients proving insufficient for the purpose; what is the amount expended upon Peamount and Rossclare up to the present time, and what will be the actual cost per bed; has the Women's National Health Association offered to provide beds at a fixed price; and, in the event of this quoted price being less than the actual cost, upon what fund will any deficiency fall?
§ Mr. BIRRELLResponsibility for maintenance and upkeep devolves upon the Women's National Health Association as occupants of premises held on trust for general sanatoria purposes. The estimated amount of expenditure out of the sanatorium Grant on Peamount is £17,945, according to particulars furnished to the Local Government Board by the architects and the Women's National Health Association. The expenditure at Rossclare is estimated to come to less than £1,700. Pending the completion of the institutions and until an account has been taken between expenditure in respect of temporary provision, as explained in my recent answer to the hon. Member for North-East Cork, and expenditure which permanently supplies contracting counties with beds, the exact cost per bed taken permanently cannot at the present time be finally ascertained with complete accuracy. The Women's National Health Association has named a figure as the estimated cost per bed, and in all probability such figure may prove to be accurate; but, however this may prove to be, the final charge against each county must be determined in the manner indicated in the reply to the hon Member for North-East Cork, to which I have already referred.
§ Mr. T. M. HEALYMay I say I could not understand the answer? Will the right hon. Gentleman lay down as a fair proposition that each county will be entitled, if it requires it, to an equal share of the Imperial Grant?
§ Mr. BIRRELLWhat I say is that any county which contracts with any association, whether the association referred to in the question or any other, will have charged against its share of the total Grant the actual cost supplied out of the £25,000.
§ Mr. T. M. HEALYWill the right hon. Gentleman say that the counties which do not align themselves with this Dublin body will be entitled to the payment of an equal share?
§ Mr. BIRRELLI think that is quite so.
§ Mr. MOOREIs a small county, with a small population, to receive the same amount as a large county?
§ Mr. BIRRELLNo, it is on a population basis.
§ Sir J. LONSDALEWho is responsible for any deficiency which may occur in the working of the Peamount institution in connection with the Women's Health Association?
§ Mr. BIRRELLThat is a question for the Women's Health Association. That association has been allowed up to an amount of £25,000 to provide beds, some on a permanent and some on a temporary basis. As soon as the money has been spent the maintenance and upkeep devolves upon the Women's Health Association.
§ Sir J. LONSDALEIn the event of its not being successful, is the place to be closed and the £25,000 to be wasted?
§ Mr. BIRRELLNo, the Peamount Institution is not the property of the Women's Health Association. It is vested in trustees.
§ Mr. BIRRELLFor the purposes of general sanatoria.
§ Mr. BIRRELLFor the country at large.
§ Mr. BIRRELLNo.
§ Mr. SWIFT MacNEILLIs it the fact that not one single farthing has been given to this society out of public funds which has not been authorised and submitted to by the Local Government Board and approved thereby?
§ Mr. BIRRELLOf course, the money has been doled out to the association on certificates of expenditure verified and examined by the Local Government Board.
§ Sir J. LONSDALEIs the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Commissioners—
§ Mr. SPEAKERThe hon. Member should give notice of any further questions on this subject.