Mr. ALAN SYKESasked (1) whether the Welsh Insurance Commissioners, when they invite the vicar of a Welsh town to convene a meeting to be addressed by one of their lecturers, also invite at the same time the ministers of any other denominations; and (2) on what principles the Welsh Insurance Commissioners select the gentleman in each locality to whom they send memorandum 51,517 Wt. 32370–1 5,000 1/12 A. and E. W., dated 23rd January, 1912, with the covering letter asking him to give them a choice of dates on which he would like a lecturer sent down to address a meeting to explain the National Insurance Act?
§ Mr. CASSELasked (1) whether the National Health Insurance Commissioners of Wales invited a clergyman in Wales to arrange for a meeting in his district, with a thorough representative audience, to be addressed by a lecturer whose 601 services would be given free of all charge; and whether the remuneration for such services will be paid out of public funds; and (2) whether the National Health Insurance Commissioners for England, Wales, and Scotland, who are endowed with wide judicial functions under the National Insurance Act, 1911, are issuing explanatory leaflets prejudging many of the questions which may come before them for judicial decision?
§ Sir A. GRIFFITH-BOSCAWENasked whether the Welsh Insurance Commissioners have issued a memorandum in which they state that they are desirous to afford all possible assistance and information in their power and to meet the general convenience of the Welsh people in Wales in every reasonable and practicable way; if so, what is meant by the expression "Welsh people in Wales"; whether the Commissioners are prepared to give any assistance to the English people in Wales; how many explanatory leaflets have been issued in English and Welsh respectively; and whether such leaflets would be paid for out of public funds?
§ Mr. GEORGE FABERasked (1) whether, in view of the fact that a Liberal organisation, now known as the Liberal Insurance Committee, has been formed by the Patronage Secretary, and lecturers appointed by that organisation, in order to popularise the National Insurance Act, it is any longer desirable in the public interest that the National Insurance Commission, which is a Government Department, should employ lecturers paid by the State to explain the advantages of that Act, and where the line is drawn between the work done by the lecturers appointed by the committee and the Commission respectively; and (2) whether at the meeting at Millbank House on the 1st instant, organised by the Liberal organisation then known as the National Insurance Committee, at which the Chancellor of the Exchequer made a speech on party lines, there were present a number of lecturers who were salaried speakers of the National Insurance Commission, paid out of public funds, and why they were invited to a party meeting; and, in the case of any of them travelling from the country in order to be present, by whom their travelling expenses were or will be paid?
§ Viscount WOLMERasked the names and addresses of the official lecturers appointed to expound the National Insurance 602 Act, and of all officials so far appointed in connection with that Act, the nature of their respective qualifications, by whom they were recommended, and by whom they were selected?
§ Mr. GINNELLasked how many persons have been appointed to positions with salaries of £200 a year and more under the National Insurance Act in Ireland; how many of them had no previous experience in insurance or similar business; and on whose recommendation were these appointed?
§ Mr. MASTERMANThe Commissioners recognised from the first their duty to supply authentic information and advice to persons affected by the Insurance Act, especially in view of the most important decisions which over fourteen millions of insured persons must necessarily take before next July, unless they sink into the class of deposit contributors. In the absence of any permanent staff who in established Government Departments provide information, both by lectures and otherwise, concerning all new Acts of Parliament to persons affected, all four Commissions engaged persons for temporary assistance for this purpose. The engagements were, of course, entirely non-political. It may interest the hon. Gentlemen who honour me by their applause to know that they included two ex-Unionist candidates for Parliament, and that one of the two English organisers, who also arranged the general course of instruction, is the late secretary of the Unionist Insurance Committee. The English Commissioners, at meetings held at the Foreign Office, with representatives of friendly societies and trade unions, were strongly urged, in the first instance, to limit themselves to private conference with members of the various organisations concerned. A large number of very successful conferences have been held, and through such conferences they hope that the necessary information may be conveyed to the bulk of insured persons; but they recognise that, in the case of women and the remoter rural districts, some further methods will have to be devised. In Scotland, Ireland, and parts of Wales, where the ground is not covered by friendly societies, it has been found impossible to convey the required information through such organisations, and lectures and addresses are therefore being given, open to all who are interested in the Insurance Act. In Wales the Memorandum and covering letter referred to in Questions Nos. 20, 21 603 and 24 were issued to clergymen of the Church of England and Nonconformist ministers, and also to head teachers of schools, the clerks of local authorities, and the secretaries of friendly societies, and trade unions. All the conferences and lectures are non-political and uncontroversial in character; the lecturers are under instructions to make no political allusion, direct or indirect; to be careful not to dogmatise on any doubtful points of law, and to confine themselves to plain exposition of what is now the law of the land. Never at any time has there been any connection between the Government insurance organisation and the body now called the Liberal Insurance Committee, nor did any of the lecturers of the Commission attend the meeting of the Liberal lecturers addressed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer on 1st February. Leaflets explanatory of the Act are in preparation, and will shortly be issued. The enormous number of letters of inquiry received—quite beyond the possibility of treatment by the present staff of the Commissioners, has demonstrated at once the necessity for this work, and also the amazing misunderstanding which prevails concerning the details of the Act by which the interests of many persons affected by the Act would be seriously prejudiced. A Paper is in preparation detailing the work already done by the Commissioners to bring the Act into operation, which will include a full account of this preliminary work of exposition. I propose to add to that Paper a list of the permanent and temporary appointments (other than clerical) at present made by the National Insurance Commissions and the Joint Committee, and to lay it on the Table of the House.
§ Mr. BRIDGEMANHave the Welsh Commissioners any authority to send out notices in Welsh to clergymen in Shropshire without being asked for them?
§ Mr. MASTERMANI do not know about the case referred to, but the Welsh Commissioners have, of course, authority to communicate information concerning the Act to all who may be affected by the Act.
Mr. ALAN SYKESWill the hon. Gentleman reply to the question whether the Welsh Commissioners, when they invited a Welsh clergyman to convene a meeting, also invited, at the same time, ministers of other denominations?
§ Mr. SPEAKERThat question was answered.
§ Mr. CASSELWill the hon. Gentleman answer the question whether the Commissioners will be able to decide judicially, having regard to their judicial powers, questions upon which they have already given a pronouncement prejudging them by these leaflets which they have issued, because I must—
§ Mr. SPEAKERThis is not the time for argument.
§ Mr. GEORGE FABERWill the hon. Gentleman say where the line is drawn between the work done by lecturers appointed by the Committee and the Commissioners respectively?
§ Mr. MASTERMANI tried to answer that question. The lectures which are given by the Commissioners are purely non-political, and are expositions of the Act as it exists at the present time. I have no claim to speak for lectures given by the Liberal Committee. I gather they will be more of a political character.
§ Mr. W. PEELAre these two ex-Conservative politicians the only exceptions to the general rule that all these lecturers are members of the Radical party, and what precedent is there for inquiring of people who are used for Civil Service purposes as to their political views?
Captain CRAIGCan the hon. Gentleman tell the House who is the lecturer at headquarters who lectures the lecturers who go lecturing in the country?
§ Mr. J. WARDDoes not the hon. Gentleman think it is a most dangerous thing to appoint a man who has been the secretary of an organisation for denouncing the Act to explain it to the people?
§ Mr. MASTERMANI think the lecturers are of a character that they will abide by the instructions given by the Commissioners.
§ Sir C. KINLOCH-COOKEHas the hon. Gentleman given any instructions to these gentlemen to explain the extraordinary statement of the Chancellor of the Exchequer that he is giving 9d. for 4d.?
§ Mr. CASSELMay I submit a point to you, Mr. Speaker? I think you said my question had been answered, but I did not catch the answer to it, my question being whether the Commissioners would be able to give judicial decisions if they had already prejudged them by explanatory leaflets?
§ Mr. MASTERMANI thought I had answered that question. I can assure the hon. Gentleman that no leaflets will be issued which will in any way prejudice the judicial functions of the Insurance Commissioners.
Mr. ALAN SYKESWill the hon. Gentleman say whether more than one person at a time in each Welsh town is invited to get together a meeting?
§ Mr. MASTERMANI should like notice of that.
Mr. TYSON WILSONasked the President of the Board of Trade whether he has invited the secretaries of trade unions to accept the position of lecturer for the purpose of attending meetings to explain and support the Insurance Act; and, if so, whether he promised those that showed ability as lecturers positions as inspectors under the Act, and assured them that they would have a good position for life?
§ The PRESIDENT of the BOARD OF TRADE (Mr. Buxton)The answer to both parts of the question is in the negative.