HC Deb 08 December 1911 vol 32 cc1809-14

  1. (1) Every shop shall, save as otherwise provided by this Act, be closed for the serving of customers not later than one o'clock in the afternoon on one week-day in every week.
  2. (2) The local authority may, by order made and revocable in like manner and subject to the like procedure and confirmation as closing orders hereinafter mentioned, fix the day on which a shop is to be so closed (in this Act referred to as the weekly half-holiday), and any such order may either fix the same day for all shops, or may fix—
    1. (a) different days for different classes of shops; or
    2. (b) different days for different parts of the district; or
    3. (c) different days for different periods of the year:

Provided that—

  1. (1) where the day fixed is a day other than Saturday, the order shall provide for enabling Saturday to be substituted for such other day; and
    2. 1810
  2. (2) where the day fixed is Saturday, the order shall provide for enabling some other day specified in the order to be substituted for Saturday,
as respects any shop in which notice to that effect is affixed by the occupier.

(3) Unless and until such an order is made affecting a shop, the weekly half-holiday as respects the shop shall be such day as the occupier may specify in a notice affixed in the shop, but it shall not be lawful for the occupier of the shop to change the day oftener than once in any period of three months.

(4) Where the local authority have reason to believe that a majority of the occupiers of shops of any particular class in any area are in favour of being exempted from the provisions of this Section, either wholly or by fixing as the closing hour instead of one o'clock some other hour not later than two o'clock, the local authority, unless they consider that the area in question is unreasonably small, shall take steps to ascertain the wishes of such occupiers, and if they are satisfied that a majority of the occupiers of such shops are in favour of the exemption, or in the case of a vote being taken that at least one-half of the votes recorded by the occupiers of shops within the area of the class in question are in favour of the exemption, the local authority shall make an order exempting the shops of that class within the area from the provisions of this Section either wholly or to such extent as aforesaid.

(5) In places frequented as holiday resorts during certain seasons of the year, the local authority may by order suspend for such period or periods as may be specified in the order, not exceeding in the aggregate four months in any year, the obligation imposed by this Section.

(6) Where a shop is closed during the whole day on the occasion of a bank or public holiday, or any day of public rejoicing or mourning, it shall be lawful for the occupier of the shop to keep the shop open for the serving of customers after the hour at which it is required under this Section to be closed either on the half-holiday immediately preceding or on the half-holiday immediately succeeding such bank or public holiday or day of public rejoicing or mourning.

(7) Subject to the provisions of this Part of this Act, this Section shall not apply to any shop in which a trade or business of any class mentioned in the Third Schedule to this Act is carried on.

Mr. GLYN-JONES

I beg to propose, in Sub-section (2), to leave out the word "may" ["local authority may"], and to insert instead thereof the word "shall."

The effect of this, which is to be taken in conjunction with my Amendment lower down on the Paper, will be that the authority must make an order fixing a day for the early closing of shops. As the Bill stands the authority may make that order selecting a certain day, but before doing so must find out whether the majority of the shopkeepers agree upon a particular day in the week. Unless they find that a majority of the shopkeepers either in a certain class or as a whole agree upon a particular day which shall be the early closing day then it will be left to each shopkeeper to select his own day. I think that is a condition of things which ought to be impossible. In every district the half-holiday is of infinitely greater importance if it is a universal half-holiday in the district. We ought to avoid separate days for separate shops if possible. As the Clause stands the shopkeeper will always have the option of selecting Saturday for some other day or some other day for Saturday, but unless we can get a majority to fix a day then, in addition to the option about Saturday, each individual shopkeeper will be left to select his own day, to the great confusion and detriment to the value of the holiday in that district. The effect of my Amendment is that the local authorities shall fix a day. But the consequential Amendment of mine says that before they do fix it they shall ascertain the wishes of the occupiers of the shops to be affected by the order as to the date to be fixed, and if the majority do not agree the local authorities shall select a day. I think that is the best way of securing a day convenient to the great majority of shopkeepers, and if opinion is so divided that no majority can be obtained for any one day, then the local authority must exercise their judgment.

Mr. HELME

I beg to second the Amendment.

Mr. MASTERMAN

I will appeal to my hon. Friend not to press his Amendment. This matter was very fully debated in Committee, and the Committee agreed that on the whole the best system was that which is adopted in the Bill. If this Amendment were adopted the local authority would have to make an order in every town for every shop in England and Wales and with all the apparatus.

Mr. GLYN-JONES

That is not what I intended.

Mr. MASTERMAN

The system of the Bill is quite a simple one. In the prescribed manner in any trade when the local authority find that the majority want a universal closing day in that trade the local authority may make the order. Where in any trade the shopkeepers are so divided in their minds as to which would be the best day to give a weekly half-holiday that a majority cannot agree on the day then they fix their own day. That is the elasticity which the Committee thought, at the request of the shopkeepers, was necessary if the weekly half-holiday was to be granted. I would ask the House to support me.

Mr. HELME

I would impress on the Government the necessity of endeavouring to meet the traders of the country in endeavouring to secure as far as possible a universal half-holiday. Traders will be placed in a very difficult position indeed if the so-called half-holiday only applied to a number of shops in one street, and if the shops in the next street were open it would practically destroy the securing of the half-holiday in this particular trade. Traders desire to meet their assistants, and we should have regard to the interests of the shopkeepers.

Mr. NORMAN CRAIG

I hope the hon. Member will not press the Amendment for this reason, if no other—there is very little liberty left under this Bill, and this piece is one of the remnants. I submit to the good sense of the House that it is manifestly absurd, if trades of this kind cannot agree, to think that the local authority is the least bit in the world entitled to impose its will upon them. The local authority is made up of all sorts of constituent elements, and it is not likely to be acquainted with the needs of particular trades. I submit that the Bill should not be so altered as to interfere with this remnant of liberty.

Mr. GRETTON

This is another instance of how hon. Members opposite try to compel people to do what they themselves prescribe should be done, and they will not allow others to know what is good for them. The seconder of the Amendment used an argument which seemed to me to destroy the whole case. He begged the House to accept the Amendment because it was the almost universal desire of the shopkeepers of the country to have one particular day for the half-holiday. But outside this Clause there is already power to deal with the matter, and to compel them to do what the Amendment suggests would defeat the very object of the Bill. I hope hon. Members opposite will not pursue these matters which have been already threshed out in Committee, and that they will allow us to make progress with the Bill.

Mr. T. DAVIES

I think the Amendment proposed by my hon. Friend would greatly facilitate the securing of the half-holiday. There is nothing so objectionable as to have so many different localities choosing different days, because it operates detrimentally to the trades and to individuals. It would be far better set out in the Bill exactly what is meant, and everybody would fall in with it, and the Act would work more smoothly than it would if the Bill passes as it at present stands.

Mr. C. E. PRICE

I beg to support the hon. Member's Amendment dealing with the weekly half-holiday. Experience shows that nothing is more difficult than to get a large number of shopkeepers to agree. Different districts stand out from the rest, but if we establish a common principle, it would really facilitate the object in view. I sincerely hope the Government will accept the Amendment.

Amendment negatived.

Amendments made: In Sub-section (2), leave out the words "made and revocable in like manner and subject to the like procedure and conformation as closing orders hereinafter mentioned."

At the end of the Sub-section, insert the words "and that no such order shall be made unless the local authority, after making such inquiry as may be prescribed, are satisfied that the occupiers of a majority of each of the several classes of shops affected by the order approve the order, and any such order may be revoked in like manner and subject to the like approval."

In Sub-section (6), after the word "mourning" ["public rejoicing or mourning"], insert the words "and that day is not the day fixed for the weekly half-holiday."

In Sub-section (7), leave out the words "Subject to the provisions of this part of this Act."

Leave out the word "Third" ["Third Schedule"], and insert instead thereof the word "Second."—[Mr Masterman.]

Mr. MASTERMAN

I beg to move, at the end of Sub-section (7), to add the words, but the local authority may, by order made and revocable in like manner as closing orders, extend the provisions of this Section to shops of any class exempted under this provision if satisfied that the occupiers of at least two-thirds of the shops of that class approve the Order. (8) The power under the Shop Hours Act, 1904, to fix a closing hour earlier than seven o'clock shall cease to have effect, and any closing order which is in force at the commencement of this Act shall cease to have effect in so far as it fixes an hour earlier than seven o'clock for any shop to which this Section applies.

Mr. GLYN-JONES

I should like to hear why it is necessary to do away with Orders made under the Act of 1904. I believe there are very many of those Orders. It is a great pity to interfere with them through this Bill, unless there is some reason for it which I do not understand.

Mr. MASTERMAN

The object of the Orders hitherto made under this Act has been to make the weekly half-holiday, but certainly no time was proposed in the Act. We propose to make the Order universal for a fixed hour.

Mr. GLYN-JONES

May I point out that there may be Orders affecting trades which are excluded under the Schedule, and whatever existing Orders there are to be cancelled, it may well be, under the provisions of the Schedule, that there are particular trades which have been excluded.

Mr. MASTERMAN

I do not think there are any Orders of that class, but if there are they ought to be exempted.

Mr. T. E. HARVEY

Perhaps the hon. Gentleman will be able later to make provisions in respect of this point.

Mr. MASTERMAN

indicated assent.

Amendment agreed to.