MR. MGHEE (Louth, S.)I beg to ask the President of the Board of Trade if he can state the number of lascars employed as sailors, firemen, coal-trimmers, boys, and assistant cooks on board the P. and O. steamship "Sumatra," which is due to leave London on 3rd March 1899; whether he can state how many cubic feet of space is provided for each lascar in the forecastles set apart for 1024 their use; whether the said vessel is a British registered vessel, registered in the United Kingdom; and whether the lascar crew of the said vessel have allotted to them the cubic accommodation as provided by the Merchant Shipping Act, 1894?
§ The following Questions on the same subject also appeared on the Paper—
§ MR. HAVELOCK WILSONTo ask the President of the Board of Trade if he can state the number of lascars employed as sailors, firemen, coal-trimmers, boys, and assistant cooks on board the Peninsular and Oriental steamship "Arcadia," which is due to leave London on the 9th March; whether he can state how many cubic feet of space is provided for each lascar in the forecastles set apart for their use; whether the said vessel is a British registered vessel registered in a port in the United Kingdom; and whether the lascar crew of the vessel have allotted to them the cubic accommodation as provided by the Merchant Shipping Act, 1894?
§ MR. MACALEESE (Monaghan, N.)To ask the President of the Board of Trade if he can state the number of lascars employed as sailors, firemen, coal-trimmers, boys, and assistant cooks on board of the Peninsular and Oriental steamship "Caledonia," which is due to leave London on 2nd March 1899; whether he can state how many cubic feet of space is provided for each lascar in the forecastles set apart for their accommodation; and whether the said vessel is a British ship registered in the United Kingdom; and whether the lascar crew of this vessel have allotted to them the cubic accommodation as provided by the Merchant Shipping Act, 1894?
§ THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD OF TRADEWith the permission of the House I will reply to all the Questions at once. The P. and O. steamers "Sumatra," "Arcadia," and "Caledonia" are British, registered vessels. The "Sumatra" is to carry 65, the "Arcadia" 132, and the "Caledonia" 157 lascars in the capacities mentioned in the Questions. The space allotted to each lascar on the "Sumatra" is rather over 71 cubic feet, on the "Arcadia" 1025 70.6 cubic feet, and on the "Caledonia" 79 cubic feet. There is thus, in the first two cases, rather less, and in the third, somewhat more, space than is required under the Imperial Act. It will, perhaps, be for the convenience of the House that I should take this opportunity of explaining the position of the law as regards crew space. Under section 210 of the Merchant Shipping Act, 1894, each seaman or apprentice is to have appropriated for his use a space of not less than 72 cubic feet and of not less than 12 superficial feet. For each contravention of this requirement the owner of the ship is liable to a fine not exceeding £20. If this were the only section operating the law "would be clear, but it is not. Under the Indian Merchant Shipping Acts, only six superficial and 36 cubic feet are required. Under section 123 of the English Act of 1894, the master or owner of any ship may enter into an agreement with lascars, and the unrepealed provisions of an old Act of the 4th Year of King George IV, specially empowering the Indian Government to make regulations with respect to the accommodation of lascars, are safeguarded. The effect of these various enactments is, that it is by no means clear whether the direct obligation in respect to crew space of the English Act or the Indian Acts obtains in regard to lascars The exact effect of these provisions has been referred for the advice, of the Law Officers of the Crown, and the Board of Trade are in communication with the Indian Government through the India Office with regard to the provisions of their law.
§ MR. HAYELOCK WILSONArising out of that answer, I should like to ask the right honourable Gentleman whether, in the case of a vessel not providing the crew with the necessary accommodation in accordance with the law, the Board of Trade will disallow any deductions from tonnage. Was not that done in the case of the "Australia," when she did not comply with the section?
THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD or TRADEThe honourable Member is complicating the whole Question. I have endeavoured to show that the law is by no means clear, and that there is a cer- 1026 tain section of an old Act of George IV. which has not been repealed, and which enables captains of British ships, even sailing from British ports, to make arrangements with lascars in accordance with the regulations of the Indian Government. It is this obscurity which prevents the Board of Trade from taking up any position definitely at the present moment; but they recognise their obligation to proceed, in accordance with the law, whatever may be the ship or the company concerned. In order to obtain the best advice they can with regard to the law, the matter has been referred to the Law Officers of the Crown.
§ MR. HAVELOCK WILSONIs the right honourable Gentleman not aware that in June 1895 the Board of Trade issued a circular dealing with the crew space, and that in it they ordered their officers—
§ MR. SPEAKEROrder, order! The honourable Member must either accept the answer, or give notice of an additional Question in the usual way.