HC Deb 03 May 1898 vol 57 cc179-81
LORD CHARLES BERESFORD

I beg to ask the First Lord of the Admiralty whether his attention has been directed to the special efforts being made by Russia, France, and Germany in new construction; whether he can inform the House of the amount of the Russian extraordinary appropriation for new construction during the next seven years, also the amounts to be expended by France and Germany, so far as they are known; when he proposes to take Vote 8 of the Naval Estimates, and whether he intends to introduce a Supplementary Estimate; and whether his naval advisers are satisfied with an Estimate of £6,288,697 for new construction in the present financial year, as compared with £7,191,043 voted last year, and £7,384,874 voted in the previous year?

THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY

My attention is, of course, directed to the scale of new construction in all naval countries. I am not prepared to make myself responsible for statements with reference to the amounts to be expended by foreign countries over a long course of years. No change that I am aware of has taken place in the French and German intentions since I presented the Navy Estimates. From Russia an extraordinary appropriation has been announced, but what amount is to be devoted to what we call new construction is uncertain. It is, no doubt, a very large proportion. Our Press has contained very full statements with regard to German, French, and Russian proposed expenditure, with which, no doubt, the noble Lord is familiar. But this whole subject is more fit for Debate than for replies to Questions which must necessarily be incomplete. In answer to the third Question, I cannot say when the Navy Estimates will be taken again, but when they are taken Vote 8 will have, of course, the most prominent place. With reference to a Supplementary Estimate, it is quite unusual to make any statements as to possible or probable action in this direction so early in the financial year. The fourth Question, as to the satisfaction of his colleagues with the Estimates, is one which the noble Lord must know no First Lord would answer, and it is therefore invidious to put it. As regards the figures quoted, the noble Lord does not compare like with like, as he adds original and Supplementary Estimates together, and compares them with original Estimates, besides giving an Estimate of £6,288,000 for 1898–9 in place of the Estimate of £7,688,000, as printed in the Navy Estimates.

LORD CHARLES BERESFORD

Arising out of that answer, I should like to ask my right honourable Friend if in his statement on the Navy Estimates he did not say that £1,400,000 was to have been spent last year, and, if so, how he can count this sum both ways, making up last year's deficiency and also as new construction?

THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY

The noble Lord counts it the wrong way. He counts it in the wrong year. The noble Lord suggests, and it is not, I think, quite proper to suggest it, that in the current financial year we are only going to spend £6,288,000 on new constuction. He calls that the Estimate for the year, but the Estimate for the year is £7,688,000. That is the amount which we propose to spend, that is the Estimate which is printed in the Blue Books, and it is misleading to call £6,288,000 the Estimate for the year.

LORD CHARLES BERESFORD

Arising out of that answer, Mr. Speaker, my Question was most distinct. Does my right honourable Friend wish it to be counted both ways?

THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY

No, I do not count it in the last year.

LORD CHARLES BERESFORD

It is counting it in the last year.

MR. SPEAKER

Order, order! This Debate must be adjourned, I think, until the Vote comes on.

SIR E. ASHMEAD-BARTLETT (Sheffield, Ecclesall)

Is it a fact that the three Powers named in the Question are constructing, or proposing to construct, 20 battleships during the next three years?

THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY

I cannot say. I do not think it is known how many battleships the Russians are going to construct. So far as my information goes, the Russians propose one, or at most two, battleships. Since that there may be more. How the fresh sum granted is to be distributed is not yet known.

MR. HERBERT LEWIS (Flint Boroughs)

Is it not a fact a battleship takes a year longer to build in foreign than in British yards?

MR. SPEAKER

Order, order!