HC Deb 23 May 1895 vol 34 cc122-5
THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER

I undertook to make a statement to-day in reference to the progress of Scotch business. What I have to state is this—that on consideration of the matter it appears to us that there is so much sharp controversy involved in the Crofters' Bill that it would be impossible to obtain such general consent to its reference to the Grand Committee as is desirable, and indeed necessary, for such a course of proceeding. We attach, and I think hon. Gentlemen opposite must attach, a great importance to the relief which may be given to the business of the House by sending to a Grand Committee measures of a comparatively non-contentious character which do not raise strong Party issues. But if an attempt were made to force measures of such a character upon a Grand Committee, it would inevitably have the effect of breaking down the whole system altogether, which would, in our opinion, be a great misfortune. That being the case, we shall propose to constitute the Grand Committee for Scotch business, and refer to it the other Scotch Bills—namely, the Fatal Accidents Inquiry Bill, the Local Government Bill, and the Fisheries Acts Amendment Bill, when it comes down from the House of Lords.

MR. BALFOUR

That will be all the Scotch Bills referred this Session?

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER

Well, all the Bills that are at present before Parliament. If there are any other Bills introduced by the Government, or by anybody else, which would seem to be fit Bills for such a Committee, I do not think they could be excluded from the consideration of the Grand Committee. That being so, the intention of the Government is to proceed with the Crofters Bill in the House, and they will use their best exertions to pass it into law. We propose to adjourn the proceedings on the Budget Bill at half-past ten to-night, so that Gentlemen may have an opportunity of expressing their opinion upon the Scotch Committee. I hope, after that statement, there will be no difficulty in electing this Scotch Committee, and so far relieving the House of business of a non-contentious character.

DR. CLARK

I wish to ask the right hon. Gentleman whether in those circumstances he will take the Second Reading of the Scotch Local Government Board Bill before the Second Reading of the Crofters' Bill.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER

The Bills going to this Committee ought to be taken as soon as possible, so as to give work to the Committee and relieve this House. I should like to take an early opportunity of sending the Local Government Bill upstairs.

MR. E. HENEAGE (Great Grimsby)

Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Scotch Fisheries Bill is not a non-contentious measure, but contains clauses affecting English interests? There is a clause in the Bill strongly opposed by English fishermen, and it ought not, therefore, to be sent to a purely Scotch Committee. I shall strongly object to such a course being taken.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER

I think this discussion would come better later on. I think the House has taken great care to prevent this being a purely Scotch Committee. I understand the object was to make the Committee a reflex of the House, and I do not think, under these circumstances, there is anything to prevent the Committee considering a Bill of this kind. I am not very familiar with the Bill, but the time for discussing this point will properly arise when the Motion is made to refer the Fisheries Bill to the Committee.

SIR D. MACFARLANE

In the event of the appointment of the Scotch Committee being agreed to after a brief discussion to-night, does the right hon. Gentleman propose to go on with the next Order on the Paper, which is the Second Reading of the Crofters Bill?

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER

I am afraid I cannot interpose the Crofters Bill in the middle of my Budget. That would be against my financial interests.

MR. WEIR

Can the right hon. Gentleman fix a day when he will take the Second Reading of the Crofters Bill, having regard to the statement made by him last Session, or will he write over the door of the House— All hope abandon, ye who enter here"?

*MR. SPEAKER

Order, order.

[No reply was given.]

SIR HERBERT MAXWELL (Wigtownshire)

asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether it would not be necessary to alter the terms of the Motion of the Secretary for Scotland, in order to make it possible to refer such a measure as the Fisheries Bill to the Scotch Grand Committee? The Motion, as it at present stood, defined the measures to be referred to that Committee as measures relating exclusively to Scotland.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EX-CHEQNER

suggested that points of that kind should be discussed later in the evening.

MR. BARTLEY

said, that with reference to the decision—he supposed of the Government—that no seriously contentious business should be referred to Grand Committees, he would like to know whether it was intended to refer to such a Committee the Bill for the repeal of the Crimes Act which the Chief Secretary for Ireland had proposed to send to a Grand Committee?

MR. W. REDMOND

inquired whether progress would be made with the Irish Land Bill before the Second Reading of the Local Veto Bill was taken?

[No reply was given, and Mr. SPEAKER called upon Mr. HERBERT GARDNER, who had a Notice of Motion upon the Paper.]

MR. W. REDMOND

May I ask the right hon. Gentleman——

*MR. SPEAKER

Order! I have called on a right hon. Member in regard to another matter on the Paper.

MR. W. REDMOND (who remained seated)

And I wish to call on the Chancellor of the Exchequer to answer my question.