HC Deb 14 June 1894 vol 25 cc1162-4

Bill considered in Committee.

(In the Committee.)

Clause 1.

Amendment proposed, in page 1, line 9, to leave out the words "and applied solely."—(Mr. A. Morley.)

Question proposed, "That the words and applied solely stand part of the Clause."

MR. BARTLEY

asked whether it was to be taken that the whole character of the Bill had been changed since the Second Reading, and that it now applied to all the trade funds of Benefit Societies?

MR. A. MORLEY

said, the Bill, as amended, would not apply to Trades Unions whose funds were devoted solely to strike purposes, though it would to those whose funds were devoted partly to strike and partly to benefit purposes.

MR. BARTLEY

said, that if the funds of all Trades Unions were to be put in the Post Office Savings Bank if there came a great commercial crisis and a general strike there would be an enormous demand on the Exchequer, and the Government would be put into a serious difficulty to meet the demand for funds. Under the Bill as it passed a Second Reading only funds used for benefit purposes could be invested by these Trade Societies. The Amendments on the Paper were all in the names of two hon. Gentlemen who were not present. The Government, however, was moving the Amendments, which would suggest that the change had been made by them. The Committee ought not to be asked to pass a Bill with such material alterations without carefully considering it.

MR. FENWICK (Northumberland, Wansbeck)

said, there were a large number of Trades Unions which did not combine benefit funds with trade funds. He did not think the hon. Member (Mr. Bartley) would be under any apprehension as to the country being plunged into serious danger through some gigantic labour dispute. The coal strike of last year was probably one of the worst ever witnessed in the country, but it occasioned no serious inconvenience to the Savings Banks or the Government. Supposing all the funds at the command of the Trades Unions were invested in the Post Office Savings Banks, and the Government were called upon to disburse them at a particular time in consequence of a general strike, all the money the Government would have to find would be less than £2,000,000 sterling. It was impossible to imagine a crisis in which every trade in the country would be striking at one and the same time. He trusted the House would accept the Amendment moved by the Postmaster General.

MR. BROMLEY-DAVENPORT (Cheshire, Macclesfield)

said, it was clear that there was debateable matter in the large change which had been made in the Bill since it had been read a second time. It was unfair that they should be asked to discuss such a measure at such an hour (12.25 a.m.). In the absence of the two hon. Members in whose names the Amendments appeared on the Paper, he begged to move to report Progress.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Chairman do report Progress, and ask leave to sit again."—(Mr. Bromley-Davenport.)

MR. A. MORLEY

said, that £2,000,000 was the total property of the Trades Unions, but only £500,000 of that was invested in the Post Office Savings Bank. The alterations in the Bill had been carefully considered by the Treasury and the National Debt Commissioners.

MR. BARTLEY

said, that a question now arose in the Bill affecting a point that many of them had been working at for years. Many of them were of opinion that large sums should be put into Consols rather than put into the Post Office Savings Bank.

MR. A. MORLEY

said, that if the Bill were allowed to go through Committee, he would agree to put off the Report stage for a fortnight so that the changes could be carefully considered. He was anxious that the Bill should pass the present stage. As to Consols, there was a provision in the Bill which would have the effect of increasing the amount of such investment so far as regarded these Trades Union funds.

MR. BROMLEY-DAVENPORT

said, he must persist in his Motion.

Question put, and agreed to.

Committee report Progress; to sit again To-morrow.