HC Deb 12 September 1893 vol 17 cc1051-3

Considered in Committee.

(In the Committee.)

SIR R. TEMPLE

asked whether the restrictions of the Bill applied to pistols which were not fire-arms, but merely specimens of art?

MR. ASQUITH

Clause 7 provides that the Bill shall not apply to the sale of any antique pistol, curiosity, or ornament.

Clause 1.

MR. BYLES (York, W.R., Shipley)

said, he was sure that if Members had examined the Bill they would never have read it a second time. He moved the rejection of Clause has involving an unnecessary interference with private liberty.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Clause be omitted."—(Mr. Byles.)

THE UNDER SECRETARY OF STATE FOE THE HOME DEPARTMENT (Mr. H.) GLADSTONE, Leeds, W.

If the clause is defeated the Bill must be dropped.

MR. CONYBEARE

supported his hon. Friend's objection, as the Bill had not received the attention which ought to have been given to it. A great deal could be said against the restrictions contained in the Bill.

Question put, "That Clause 1, as amended, stand part of the Bill."

The Committee divided:—Ayes 109; Noes 17.—(Division List, No. 305.)

Clause 2 to 6, inclusive, agreed to.

SIR R. TEMPLE

said, he would like to know whether a pistol of modern make, but intended purely for ornament, would come within the restrictions of the clause?

MR. ASQUITH

said, unless the exemption was strictly limited to "antique" pistols it would be liable to abuse.

MR. CONYBEARE

said, the clause was open to grave objection in that respect. He would suggest that the word "historical" be introduced to meet the difficulty.

MR. H. GLADSTONE

said, the word would not remove the feature which the hon. Member considered objectionable.

Clause agreed to.

Clause 8 agreed to.

Clause 9.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Clause be omitted."

MR. A. C. MORTON (Peterborough)

said, it was surprising that any Radical Government should propose such a clause as this. Any Government doing so deserved censure.

MR. CONYBEARE

said, before they passed away from this, he thought they should have some reason assigned for the introduction of such a clause. There might be reasons for the passing of the Bill, but they were entitled to some explanation for the appearance of this clause.

Question put, and agreed to.

Clauses 10 and 11 agreed to.

Clause 12.

MR. CONYBEARE

said, the definition of a pistol as a firearm of less than 15 in. in length should be amended, so as to exclude toy-pistols and other such harmless weapons.

MR. H. GLADSTONE

said, the definition was considered satisfactory as it stood.

MR. STUART-WORTLEY (Sheffield, Hallam)

said, perhaps the insertion of the words "capable of inflicting grievous bodily harm" would meet the case.

MR. ASQUITH

said, such words would be most objectionable, because serious injury was often inflicted with toys. The question had been carefully considered, and they were not prepared to adopt these suggestions.

MR. STUART-WORTLEY

thought the words he suggested would meet the case.

MR. CONYBEARE

Do we understand that the Bill will apply to small pistols?

MR. ASQUITH

Yes.

Clause agreed to.

Remaining clauses agreed to.

Bill reported; as amended, to be considered upon Thursday, and to be printed. [Bill 458.]