HC Deb 20 March 1893 vol 10 cc607-9

Resolution 1 [see page 395] agreed to. 2. "That a sum, not exceeding £5,876,400, be granted to Her Majesty, to defray the Charge of the Pay, Allowances, and other Charges of Her Majesty's Army at Home and Abroad (exclusive of India) (General Staff, Regiments, Reserve, and Departments), which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1894.

SIR RICHARD TEMPLE (Surrey, Kingston)

asked the Secretary of State for War whether he would give some information on the question which he addressed to him the other day with regard to the coaling stations at Thursday Island and St. George's Sound?

THE SECRETARY OF STATE FOR WAR (Mr. CAMPBELL - BANNERMAN,) Stirling, &c.

The work of the proposed two coaling stations are under the responsibility of the Colonial Authorities, and to the best of our belief they are almost entirely finished. The whole armament has been issued with the exception of a very small part which is ready for shipment. The garrison will be provided by the Colonial Authorities, and will consist of a permanent force and local auxiliary.

COLONEL NOLAN (Gralway, N.)

asked what action the right hon. Gentleman had taken with regard to Captain Lugard and Captain Williams, the two gentlemen who had taken a leading part in Uganda? He believed their salaries were included in this Vote, and, if so, he would like to ask the right hon. Gentleman had he taken any action whatever in regard to their conduct in Uganda? He did not mind stating to the House that Captain Lugard and Captain Williams had organised the massacre of Catholics by Protestants in Uganda. [Cries of " Oh, oh!"] He adopted the word "massacre" from the military books, and he did not wish it to apply in any way except to mean that a good many people had been killed. He wished to know had these officers been allowed to return to their regiments, and whether they had instructions to take sides in a dispute between two Religious Bodies in Uganda?

MR. CAMPBELL-BANNERMAN

I wish to point out to the hon. and gallant Gentleman that while officers are engaged on such duties their military pay is abandoned. None of the gentlemen named received any pay while they were in Africa, but Captain Lugard having returned to this country, I presume he is in receipt of pay now. He was not in receipt of it while in Uganda.

MR. A. C. MORTON

said, he had not brought forward in Committee matters of which he had given notice with regard to this Vote, in order that the Business of the Government might not be delayed; but he understood that they were to be allowed a general Debate on the Army Vote on another occasion. He should like to be clear on that point in order to preserve the rights of private Members, and the right to discuss the condition and treatment of the private soldier.

MR. CAMPBELL-BANNERMAN

The understanding that we should have a Debate on the Army Vote in June was arrived at with a view to concluding the discussion in Committee on a certain night, but the discussion was carried over that night, and so the arrangement was cancelled. There will be a Debate in June, but not a general discussion.

MR. A. C. MORTON

I refrained from speaking on the Vote in Committee, and I do not think the fact that other hon. Members prolonged the Debate should be used against me. I hope the right hon. Gentleman will keep his promise.

Resolution agreed to.

Resolutions 3 to 6 [see page 416] agreed to.